D&D 5E What is your definition of a Vanilla setting
Voadam
Legend
I think of Greyhawk as more vanilla medieval 1e D&D and Forgotten Realms as more vanilla high magic D&D so 5e with magic options for most everybody by level 3 I lean a little more to FR as the 5e default vanilla. Both have lots of non vanilla elements (Scarlet Brotherhood, Iuz, Red Wizards, elven mythals) but they are fairly stock D&D.
Dragonlance takes a lot out like orcs, messes with some expectations (the three orders of mages and their connections to specific magic and the moons), has twists on standards as exemplified by the Gully Dwarves, Tinker Gnomes, and Kender, and some different expectations such as minotaurs being a major race. Of the three it is the least vanilla IMO.
Dragonlance takes a lot out like orcs, messes with some expectations (the three orders of mages and their connections to specific magic and the moons), has twists on standards as exemplified by the Gully Dwarves, Tinker Gnomes, and Kender, and some different expectations such as minotaurs being a major race. Of the three it is the least vanilla IMO.
So, essentially, the Known World- later known as Mystara- that was the assumed setting for Moldvay Basic D&D. No extra fluff at all- just the maps with names in the modules. It was the ultimate vanilla setting- because it wasn't a setting- it just WAS.
Later, of course, they built it up into it's own thing: Mystara. Inc the Hollow World sets. Still more or less a generic D&D setting. It's only real quirk had to do with B/X and BECMI's emphasis on law vs chaos, rather than good vs evil.
That would be my pick. (and nyah!!! cuz it's not on the list)
I DID pick Greyhawk because it was the assumed setting for so long over multiple editions- and that's where all the OG flavor elements (like Bigby's, Tenser's, etc spells etc) came from. And also because it fits the criteria explained a few posts up.
The Realms has a VAST amount of lore and crunchy bits- much of which can easily be ported over to 5E. It only feels vanilla, because the majority of it is left out of official adventures and such. Probably both for brevity reasons (3E alone had more than a dozen hardbound suppliments, and an equal number of softcover ones), and to make it easier to mix n match bits and pieces into any world. AFAIK they haven't released much if anything under the Forgotten Realms Campaign setting banner yet. Yes, the modules tend to default there- but those are such a "Lite" version of the setting, they make the Starter set look like a complete Oxford dictionary.
Voadam
Legend
I would not call Eberron vanilla D&D.
It has all the D&D elements but it twists lots of them. Elves with the Deathless. Halflings ride Dinosaurs. Gods are a step removed and possibly not there. It adds in its own stuff of elemental ships and trains, Dragonmarks, Dragon shards, artificers and warforged, a psionic continent and player race, different cosmology. Its default tone is magical noir post WWI instead of high magic ren faire.
Base D&D is vanilla, Eberron adds on a lot of toppings to make a sundae.
It has all the D&D elements but it twists lots of them. Elves with the Deathless. Halflings ride Dinosaurs. Gods are a step removed and possibly not there. It adds in its own stuff of elemental ships and trains, Dragonmarks, Dragon shards, artificers and warforged, a psionic continent and player race, different cosmology. Its default tone is magical noir post WWI instead of high magic ren faire.
Base D&D is vanilla, Eberron adds on a lot of toppings to make a sundae.
Snarf Zagyg
Notorious Liquefactionist
So, here's the thing. I voted for Forgotten Realms as "vanilla" (in the sense of plain), but I don't think that's quite right.
FR is distinctive in the sense that it is the "base" setting in 5e. It also has the most thoroughly mapped out lore and world, along with numerous sub-settings that have been subsumed into the FR whole (Al Qadim, Kara Tur, Underdark, Maztica etc.).
In other words, FR provides everything you could ever want in a setting. Tons of lore, tons of crunch, a whole world, and multiple different distinctive areas. Of course, this is the same problem that many people have with it- many players are familiar with the lore (through novels etc.), there is the feeling that the players don't matter given the exploits of so many known and powerful NPCs, and the world is largely known.
Greyhawk, for multiple reasons, is different. There is not the same level of lore or crunch, and the "setting" is only one part of one continent, with the rest of the entire world being unexplored rumor (and not canon). The familiarity most people have with it are from names of things from the past that aren't present, and the general vibe is one of "uncaring," in the sense that the powerful NPCs are pursuing their own agendas and don't care much about the players or, for that matter, the world.
Dragonlance is completely different, again. Traditionally, it has been presented in the context of the heroic railroad - the War of the Lance. The setting certainly exists independently of this (and is interesting), but there has always been such a strong tie-in with specific stories it is often difficult to disentangle them.
All of this is, of course, IMO. None of this is something that I would necessarily call vanilla; someone who loves the lore of FR wouldn't think it's vanilla, just as someone who loves the distinctiveness of GH wouldn't say that either. I certainly don't think DL is vanilla.
For that matter, good vanilla is amazing. Probably the best flavor. You can take you chocolate and shove it down your own pie hole. Ima enjoy some high class vanilla, thankuverymuch!
FR is distinctive in the sense that it is the "base" setting in 5e. It also has the most thoroughly mapped out lore and world, along with numerous sub-settings that have been subsumed into the FR whole (Al Qadim, Kara Tur, Underdark, Maztica etc.).
In other words, FR provides everything you could ever want in a setting. Tons of lore, tons of crunch, a whole world, and multiple different distinctive areas. Of course, this is the same problem that many people have with it- many players are familiar with the lore (through novels etc.), there is the feeling that the players don't matter given the exploits of so many known and powerful NPCs, and the world is largely known.
Greyhawk, for multiple reasons, is different. There is not the same level of lore or crunch, and the "setting" is only one part of one continent, with the rest of the entire world being unexplored rumor (and not canon). The familiarity most people have with it are from names of things from the past that aren't present, and the general vibe is one of "uncaring," in the sense that the powerful NPCs are pursuing their own agendas and don't care much about the players or, for that matter, the world.
Dragonlance is completely different, again. Traditionally, it has been presented in the context of the heroic railroad - the War of the Lance. The setting certainly exists independently of this (and is interesting), but there has always been such a strong tie-in with specific stories it is often difficult to disentangle them.
All of this is, of course, IMO. None of this is something that I would necessarily call vanilla; someone who loves the lore of FR wouldn't think it's vanilla, just as someone who loves the distinctiveness of GH wouldn't say that either. I certainly don't think DL is vanilla.
For that matter, good vanilla is amazing. Probably the best flavor. You can take you chocolate and shove it down your own pie hole. Ima enjoy some high class vanilla, thankuverymuch!
Mercurius
Legend
I agree that vanilla is underrated and if done well, is in some ways the best flavor of ice cream - certainly the most versatile.
I'd suggest that all settings have a vanilla base, with variances added on top.
Dragonlance is Neopolitan - with vanilla present, but also strawberry and chocolate.
Eberron is salted caramel. The vanilla is there underneath holding the distinct caramel flavor, which is contrasted with a bit of saltyness.
FR is like one of those wacky Ben & Jerry's flavors that have a bit of everything ("Everything but the...").
Greyhawk is like vanilla made with brown sugar. It is vanilla, but has the distinct flavor and color of its creator.
Dark Sun is like vanilla swirled with orange sorbet. It is still ice cream (fantasy), but has a tartness and is almost different enough to be something else.
Or something like that.
I'd suggest that all settings have a vanilla base, with variances added on top.
Dragonlance is Neopolitan - with vanilla present, but also strawberry and chocolate.
Eberron is salted caramel. The vanilla is there underneath holding the distinct caramel flavor, which is contrasted with a bit of saltyness.
FR is like one of those wacky Ben & Jerry's flavors that have a bit of everything ("Everything but the...").
Greyhawk is like vanilla made with brown sugar. It is vanilla, but has the distinct flavor and color of its creator.
Dark Sun is like vanilla swirled with orange sorbet. It is still ice cream (fantasy), but has a tartness and is almost different enough to be something else.
Or something like that.
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Bitbrain
Lost in Dark Sun
I described Eberron to my group as a D&D Noir-Pulp Mirror Universe. After just two sessions, they said it was a pretty good to explain that world.
ART!
Deluxe Unhuman
I went with FR.
I guess my definition would be a setting that requires no changes, variants, or exceptions to the rules that are in the core books.
I honestly can't judge Greyhawk or Dragonlance very well, having had very little experience with them, so really I'm going by stuff I've read about them.
I guess my definition would be a setting that requires no changes, variants, or exceptions to the rules that are in the core books.
I honestly can't judge Greyhawk or Dragonlance very well, having had very little experience with them, so really I'm going by stuff I've read about them.
Laurefindel
Legend
Vanilla =/= kitchen sink, and vice versa
None of the above are « true vanilla ». Greyhawk probably would be closest, but there are no modern metrics to use as a reference.
« Vanilla » for me is when you take everything from the PHB as is, without refluff, additions, or limitations, and plug directly into the setting. Among the options listed above, FR is probably closest to vanilla 5e
None of the above are « true vanilla ». Greyhawk probably would be closest, but there are no modern metrics to use as a reference.
« Vanilla » for me is when you take everything from the PHB as is, without refluff, additions, or limitations, and plug directly into the setting. Among the options listed above, FR is probably closest to vanilla 5e
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