green slime
First Post
begone foul beast...
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What LA are a half-celestial's stat boosts worth?
- Thread starter shilsen
- Start date
green slime
First Post
Nevermind, nothing to see here...
Ridley's Cohort
First Post
A weak +2 LA for a spellcaster. A medium +2 LA for everyone else.
It would be far too attractive at +1 LA. The pure spellcaster classes can easily justify losing a level to gain the boosts to DCs, saves, and HPs. It would be a fabulous deal to a melee class.
The full-fledged Half-Celestial template should be rated a +3 LA.
It would be far too attractive at +1 LA. The pure spellcaster classes can easily justify losing a level to gain the boosts to DCs, saves, and HPs. It would be a fabulous deal to a melee class.
The full-fledged Half-Celestial template should be rated a +3 LA.
Lord Pendragon
First Post
I'm not so sure. For a melee character, the hp are a wash, and the attack bonus is a wash (+2 either way), except that for an extra +2 or +3 (2HW) to damage, you're delaying iterative attacks by 2 levels. You're also delaying any class-based special abilities by 2 levels as well.Darklone said:
I'm just not seeing what makes it a "fabulous deal."
Now the full Half-Celestial at +2 LA, that is a fabulous deal. But just the stat bonuses at +2 is a loser IMO.
Ridley's Cohort
First Post
Lord Pendragon,
It looks pretty fair at +2 for a pure Fighter.
Pro: +2/+3 damage, modest boost to saves, more skillpoints, betters stats to modify skills.
Con: 1 Fighter feat, 2/3 a regular feat, delay in iterative attack
HPs look like a wash.
That is pretty fair. Looks like a modest net gain.
At +1 LA we have...
Pro: +1 to hit, +2/3 damage, a net ~+4 to saves, a growing HP boost after ~5th level, more skillpoints, better stats to modify skills
Con: lose almost a feat, small delay in iterative attack
That is a good deal at +1 LA. Too good a deal. It gets even better when you start looking at character classes that can take advantage of a broad range of stats (Monk, Paladin, Ranger, Swashbuckler, etc.) and you get past 10th level.
It looks pretty fair at +2 for a pure Fighter.
Pro: +2/+3 damage, modest boost to saves, more skillpoints, betters stats to modify skills.
Con: 1 Fighter feat, 2/3 a regular feat, delay in iterative attack
HPs look like a wash.
That is pretty fair. Looks like a modest net gain.
At +1 LA we have...
Pro: +1 to hit, +2/3 damage, a net ~+4 to saves, a growing HP boost after ~5th level, more skillpoints, better stats to modify skills
Con: lose almost a feat, small delay in iterative attack
That is a good deal at +1 LA. Too good a deal. It gets even better when you start looking at character classes that can take advantage of a broad range of stats (Monk, Paladin, Ranger, Swashbuckler, etc.) and you get past 10th level.
dont forget falling behind for level based feats and the stat point 
I think that +6 to all stats for a +2 level adjustment is probably just about right. Everyone takes a hit, everyone gets a bonus, and the bonus is actually worth enough that people might take it now and then for more than purely flavor reasons (people play pet rocks whose only ability is to shout derisively for 'flavor reasons').
Effectively it amounts to more natural talent but less training. Less hd, less base whatevers, less max rank for skills (this is actually a pretty big loss although it is easy to overlook), less attacks, less class abilities, etc.
Some classes will get a bigger boost than others, that is the way of everything. Overall though I think it would work out pretty well. Primary spellcasters lose out on a full level of spells but gain higher dcs and are tougher to kill, trading offense/defense/utility for a different form of offense/defense/utility. Dc's will be ahead, effects will be behind, that sort of thing.
Hp wise the crossing point will be earlier (for awhile one will be behind then the other will be behind) but with being 2hd behind any con boosting items will be slightly more effective for the guy without the template, pushing the transition point further back.
Still, I dont think it is a 'must have' or 'must not do' for pretty much anyone. It is a tough choice. Some builds make the choice easier (some still fall into the definately or definately not camps) but for the most part.. being behind by 2 levels of class abilities can definately hurt at times.
I think that +6 to all stats for a +2 level adjustment is probably just about right. Everyone takes a hit, everyone gets a bonus, and the bonus is actually worth enough that people might take it now and then for more than purely flavor reasons (people play pet rocks whose only ability is to shout derisively for 'flavor reasons').
Effectively it amounts to more natural talent but less training. Less hd, less base whatevers, less max rank for skills (this is actually a pretty big loss although it is easy to overlook), less attacks, less class abilities, etc.
Some classes will get a bigger boost than others, that is the way of everything. Overall though I think it would work out pretty well. Primary spellcasters lose out on a full level of spells but gain higher dcs and are tougher to kill, trading offense/defense/utility for a different form of offense/defense/utility. Dc's will be ahead, effects will be behind, that sort of thing.
Hp wise the crossing point will be earlier (for awhile one will be behind then the other will be behind) but with being 2hd behind any con boosting items will be slightly more effective for the guy without the template, pushing the transition point further back.
Still, I dont think it is a 'must have' or 'must not do' for pretty much anyone. It is a tough choice. Some builds make the choice easier (some still fall into the definately or definately not camps) but for the most part.. being behind by 2 levels of class abilities can definately hurt at times.
