What on earth does "video-gamey" mean?

[TimeOut]

I see a lot teeth gnashing, and no shortage of insults directed at people who see similarities between 4.0 and videogames. I don't understand why the fact that some people see these similarities is so threatening to so many people at ENworld. I'm not going to bother guessing why.

It is not the opinion that is the problem, it is how many people have chosen to present their opinion.

Of course there will be similarities to video games or video game culture. And there will even be similarities to movies and movie culture! Or, gasp, books!

But many people say this as if it was a really bad thing. And with that many other people disagree. It is all a matter of presentation, not of basic opinion.

 

[Tsyr]

I guess it boils down to this:

Drawing thematics from books, movies, or videogames is fine. Drawing your mechanics from video games, not so much. I can play a video game. To my mind, using pen and paper to try to recreate a video game is by definition the least efficient way to get the experience of playing a video game.

 

[Jedi_Solo]

Drawing thematics from books, movies, or videogames is fine. Drawing your mechanics from video games, not so much.

Why?

The above statement comes across (to me) as saying that the rule/mechanic/theory is off limits simply because it is from a video game. Other have stated that opinion out right in other threads and I don't get it.

If something is in a video game and "Is Good" (whatever that thing may be and whatever qualifies to be 'good' to you) why can't it be pulled into a tabletop game?

 

[Doug McCrae]

Seriously - video games are a HUGE and diverse collection. How is calling something "video-gamey" supposed to mean anything? You might as well just be calling it "thingy" for all the specificity it entails.

Yeah, that's it. The vagueness is the problem. Which videogame do they mean? Pong? Tetris? Shadow of the Colossus? It's lazy writing, leaving the reader to do a heckuva lot of work.

As with the similarly used 'anime' I can sort of figure out what they're criticising. Maybe. But I'm having to do a lot of guesswork.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

It. Feels. Like. A. Videogame.

Does. It. Do. So. When. Playing?

Because I'd find that strange. Sitting before my PC at home and setting at the game table is intrinsically so different that I can't believe this to be true. The fact alone that there are 3-5 other guys I talk with _in person_ is very different from any video-game I play.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I guess it boils down to this:

Drawing thematics from books, movies, or videogames is fine. Drawing your mechanics from video games, not so much.

And that I can only see as wrong. You just have to pick the mechanics that work well with a clever mind like a DM , instead of the stupidity of a computer processor. And maybe fit the thematics. (I shudder at the thought of a Tetris-inspired role-playing game...)

Everything else is just designing a good game.

 

[Doug McCrae]

It means "like a video game", or if you prefer, "has many elements that are also found in popular video games, which notoriously can handle complex math and if-then type discreet decisions, and is famously combat oriented at the expense of any true freedom or interaction beyond which mook to smite".

All popular roleplaying games are combat-oriented, with the one exception of Call of Cthulhu, which is investigation-oriented. The White Wolf games pretend to be roleplay-oriented while in reality providing the killing and level-up action that people enjoy so much.

And how on earth could any rpg remove 'any true freedom beyond which mook to smite'? Even FATAL doesn't do that.

 

[Tsyr]

Why?

The above statement comes across (to me) as saying that the rule/mechanic/theory is off limits simply because it is from a video game. Other have stated that opinion out right in other threads and I don't get it.

If something is in a video game and "Is Good" (whatever that thing may be and whatever qualifies to be 'good' to you) why can't it be pulled into a tabletop game?

I'm not saying it can NEVER happen, but in most cases it shouldn't. Video games are a completely different animal. They are meant to provide almost the exact same play experience to everyone who plays them - same possibilities, same amount of buttons pressed more or less, same "fun factor" in all situations. They are automated systems meant to be run without the guiding hand of a DM to make things work correctly. They are designed to restrict players to doing only things that the system wants them to do - free thought outside of that system is discouraged, and often punished as "cheating". They're designed to have a clear progression from a starting point to an ending point, with very clear expectations of exactly what every player is capable of at every level of play.

Or, lets put this another way: You're fine with the inclusion of agro mechanics. Ok. What if 5E assumes "resurrection points" in the world where your character comes back to life after death? What if, beyond stat blocks, in 5E monster fights are scripted events that tell the DM exactly what the monster does on every round of the encounter? I don't care, pick a mechanic. There are plenty of mechanics that you probably wouldn't want in a game, right? Because they would feel like a video game to you, not a fun, 'realistic' world. I, and others like me, think 4E has crossed that threshold already. You, and others like you, think it hasn't - but you probably agree that threshold exists somewhere, right?

 

[Doug McCrae]

2) I think the powers system draws a lot of these complaints. "More Abilities = More Fun" seems to be the growing trend in MMOs... Fighters in early MMOs were like fighters in past versions of DnD. They hit stuff with sharp things. Now fighters in current MMOS don't hit things with sharp stuff, they perform "Dance of the Seven Blades" or "Lunging Doomsday Thrust". The focus on the "class role" seems to be kind of the same thing.

Ah, so you use 'videogame-y' to mean 'anime'.

 

[thedungeondelver]

It is not the opinion that there are similarities, it is how many people have chosen to present their opinion.

Yes, how dare they!

There's an old saying that goes something like 'If one man calls you a horse, that man is a fool. If ten men call you a horse, buy yourself a saddle.'

It is time, methinks, D&D buys itself a saddle.