What role am I filling with this character?

[ravenheart]

Hi guys,

I'm the regular DM for my group, but I might actually get to play in our next adventure (!). Therefore I've been tinkering on a character, and actually introduced a potential future PC as an NPC in the current campaign (that I'm DMing). The group consists of 4 players (originally 6, a lot of fluctuation):

Eladrin Illusionist Wizard
Genasi Trickster Rogue
Elven Beastmaster Ranger
Half-elf Bravura Warlord

Now these characters are mostly built from flavor and story perspectives, not for optimization. Due to the lack of a dedicated defender and only one "real" ranged character the are very versatile when it comes to combat roles and can mix it up in melee and ranged combat versus all kinds of foes quite easily. And they have healing spread around. All good then.

Now here's my problem - how do I make a fitting fifth character for this group of misfits (j/k)? Presumably, the player that is playing the wizard is going to try out DMing (and remove his character temporarily from the story - unless I do it for him...), meaning the group would suddenly find itself without a defender and a controller.

We are currently looking for a fifth player to round out the team, and we have some candidates lined up (all new to Dnd). I'll try to encourage the newbies to pick a class of one of the missing roles (defender primarily, pitching for fighter). From what I've gathered, controllers are in some cases superfluos, but that still leaves an open spot for a character with some real ranged potential.

Which leads me to something I statted up after reading a thread on RPG.net on the most improbable 4E character concepts. Voíla:

[sblock]====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Quinn, level 7
Human, Warlock|Swordmage
Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Infernal Pact (Hybrid)
Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Will
Swordmage Aegis (Hybrid): Aegis of Shielding
Hybrid Talent: Swordmage Warding
Background: Birth - On Another Plane, Occupation - Punisher, Human - Ancestral Holdings (+2 to Intimidate)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 8, Con 18, Dex 10, Int 18, Wis 10, Cha 13.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 8, Con 17, Dex 10, Int 15, Wis 10, Cha 13.


AC: 23 Fort: 21 Reflex: 21 Will: 20
HP: 61 Surges: 11 Surge Value: 15

TRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +16, Insight +10, Athletics +9, Religion +14, Intimidate +13

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +5, Bluff +6, Diplomacy +6, Dungeoneering +5, Endurance +9, Heal +5, History +11, Nature +5, Perception +5, Stealth +5, Streetwise +6, Thievery +5

FEATS
Bardic Ritualist: Ritual Caster
Human: Bardic Ritualist
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Deva Heritage
Level 4: Arcane Familiar
Level 6: Intelligent Blademaster

POWERS
Bonus At-Will Power: Hellish Rebuke
Hybrid Swordmage at-will 1: Lightning Lure
Hybrid Warlock at-will 1: Eyes of the Vestige
Hybrid encounter 1: Diabolic Grasp
Hybrid daily 1: Tyranny of Flame
Hybrid utility 2: Host of Shields
Hybrid encounter 3: Dimensional Vortex
Hybrid daily 5: Lingering Lightning
Hybrid utility 6: Life Siphon
Hybrid encounter 7: Dazing Rebuke

ITEMS
Adventurer's Kit, Shadowdance Leather Armor +1, Hedge Wizard's Gloves (heroic tier), Steadfast Amulet +2, Obsidian Steed (heroic tier), Ioun's Revelation (level 3), Woodwind, Residuum (Any) (150), Farbond Spellblade Broadsword +2, Spellshard, Potion of Clarity (level 5)
RITUALS
Simbul's Conversion, Battlefield Elocution, Object Reading, Last Sight Vision, Iron Vigil, Traveler's Chant, Hand of Fate, Seek Rumor
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======[/sblock]

Concept: An exalted warrior of Ioun forced into a pact with a devil (I'll provide a full writeup of the concept when I'm not sleep-typing).
I actually introduced this character, or at least something similar, to the campaign as an NPC in a climactic battle, and I have a good idea how I could convert him into a PC by the end of the adventure.

I like to keep a good balance between flavor and optimization, but it can't hurt to run the numbers. My main concern is that he's to spread thin (strikery-defender with a hint of controller) that he won't be really good at anything. I'm also waiting until the supposed fifth player has confirmed what they're playing. Thoughts, suggestions?

A note on house rules:
+1 to FRW at 4th, 14th and 24th level
+1 to Attack at 8th, 18th and 28th level
+1 to AC at 11th and 21st level
I've given out more treasure to the party than is intended (intentionally as well as due to the confusion of a fluctuating party size), and therefore I added 1000 gp (+100 gp for mundane items) and turned the level-1 item into liquid funds.

Just for fun, I prophesized a higher level version of the char:
[sblock]====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Quinn - 11, level 11
Human, Warlock|Swordmage, Paragon Hybrid
Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Infernal Pact (Hybrid)
Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Will
Swordmage Aegis (Hybrid): Aegis of Shielding
Hybrid Talent: Swordmage Warding
Twofold Pact: Vestige Pact
Paragon Hybrid Talent: Prime Shot
Background: Birth - On Another Plane, Occupation - Punisher, Human - Ancestral Holdings (+2 to Intimidate)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 9, Con 20, Dex 11, Int 20, Wis 11, Cha 14.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 8, Con 17, Dex 10, Int 15, Wis 10, Cha 13.


AC: 28 Fort: 25 Reflex: 25 Will: 24
HP: 83 Surges: 12 Surge Value: 20

TRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +19, Insight +12, Athletics +11, Religion +17, Intimidate +16

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +7, Bluff +9, Diplomacy +9, Dungeoneering +7, Endurance +12, Heal +7, History +14, Nature +7, Perception +7, Stealth +7, Streetwise +9, Thievery +7

FEATS
Bardic Ritualist: Ritual Caster
Human: Bardic Ritualist
Level 1: Hybrid Talent
Level 2: Deva Heritage
Level 4: Arcane Familiar
Level 6: Intelligent Blademaster
Level 8: Focused Expertise (Broadsword)
Level 10: Bardic Knowledge (retrained to Called Shot at Level 11)
Level 11: Twofold Pact

POWERS
Bonus At-Will Power: Hellish Rebuke
Hybrid Swordmage at-will 1: Booming Blade
Hybrid Warlock at-will 1: Dire Radiance
Paragon Hybrid: Mordant Rains of Dis
Hybrid encounter 1: Diabolic Grasp
Hybrid daily 1: Tyranny of Flame
Hybrid utility 2: Host of Shields
Hybrid encounter 3: Dimensional Vortex
Hybrid daily 5: Lingering Lightning
Hybrid utility 6: Life Siphon
Hybrid encounter 7: Dazing Rebuke
Hybrid daily 9: Iron Spike of Dis
Hybrid utility 10: Conviction

ITEMS
Adventurer's Kit, Hedge Wizard's Gloves (heroic tier), Obsidian Steed (heroic tier), Ioun's Revelation (level 3), Woodwind, Residuum (Any) (250), Spellshard, Shadowdance Leather Armor +2, Farbond Spellblade Broadsword +3, Amulet of Protection +3, Siberys Shard of the Mage (heroic tier), Phylactery of Action (heroic tier)
RITUALS
Simbul's Conversion, Battlefield Elocution, Object Reading, Last Sight Vision, Iron Vigil, Traveler's Chant, Hand of Fate, Seek Rumor
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======[/sblock]
See what I did there?

EDIT: Funny, Eyes of the Vestige doesn't show up although I took the Vestige Pact as my Twofold Pact - anyway, it's probably broken regardless, so I might as well take Prime Punisher instead.

 

[Theroc]

I am not an expert on the stuff you've listed, as I have no access to swordmages or to vestige pact nor to hybrids, but it would appear your character would be a striking Defender who exerts a bit of control.

You would want to be continually moving about the battlefield, smiting your enemies and running away (for the concealment Warlock benefit) forcing them to attack a concealed defender who can hit hard, or strike at an enemy and do hardly anything.

Since your group is atypical and not built around 'optimization' so much, I would imagine your DM will not throw encounters that force a typical group in so much, allowing you to shine as much as your fellows, from what I could see.

But, I really hardly know anything except that Swordmages(Aegis anyway) tend to mark then run away and fight something else, and that Warlocks get harder to hit when they're moving.

 

[Llamas Notsheep]

I think you're right in looking at a defender with some cross-role flavor. Controllers are always nice to have, but never really vital.

That looks pretty similar to a Swordmage|warlock I'm going to be using for an upcoming short-term adventure. We're going to be playing in paragon, which is where the build really comes into its own. It certainly looks viable before that, though. I'm working with fey pact in order to grab the feytouched paragon path. Admittedly, that's mostly for the numbers game, as I'm looking at a short-term game. Here's the setup, with two extra items added as a proof of concept:

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Roy Tayburn, level 14
Human, Swordmage|Warlock, Feytouched
Hybrid Talent: Swordmage Warding
Swordmage Aegis (Hybrid): Aegis of Shielding
Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Fey Pact (Hybrid)
Eldritch Strike: Eldritch Strike Constitution
Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Reflex
Twofold Pact: Infernal Pact

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 13, Con 22, Dex 9, Int 20, Wis 11, Cha 13.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 12, Con 16, Dex 8, Int 16, Wis 10, Cha 12.


AC: 31 Fort: 28 Reflex: 29 Will: 25
HP: 100 Surges: 13 Surge Value: 25

TRAINED SKILLS
Intimidate +13, Bluff +13, Arcana +17, Endurance +18

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +6, Diplomacy +8, Dungeoneering +7, Heal +7, History +12, Insight +7, Nature +7, Perception +7, Religion +12, Stealth +6, Streetwise +8, Thievery +6, Athletics +8

FEATS
Human: Hybrid Talent
Level 1: Weapon Proficiency (Bastard sword)
Level 2: Weapon Focus (Heavy Blade)
Level 4: White Lotus Riposte
Level 6: White Lotus Defense (retrained to Greater Aegis of Shielding at Level 11)
Level 8: Mark of Warding
Level 10: Toughness (retrained to Starfire Womb at Level 12)
Level 11: Twofold Pact
Level 12: Greater Swordmage Warding
Level 14: Double Aegis
Feat User Choice: Focused Expertise (Bastard sword)

POWERS
Bonus At-Will Power: Eyes of the Vestige
Hybrid Swordmage at-will 1: Sword Burst
Hybrid Warlock at-will 1: Eldritch Strike
Hybrid encounter 1: Chains of Levistus
Hybrid daily 1: Armor of Agathys
Hybrid utility 2: Dimensional Warp
Hybrid encounter 3: Dimensional Vortex
Hybrid daily 5: Swordmage Shielding Fire
Hybrid utility 6: Fey Switch
Hybrid encounter 7: Rejuvenating Strike
Hybrid daily 9: Glamor Blade
Hybrid utility 10: Etheral Sidestep
Hybrid encounter 13: Seed of Fire (replaces Rejuvenating Strike)

ITEMS
Cloak of Translocation +3, Circlet of Indomitability (heroic tier), Escape Tattoo (heroic tier), Blackleaf Gloves (heroic tier), Belt of Breaching (paragon tier), Planestrider Boots (paragon tier), Eladrin Ring of Passage (paragon tier), Blade of the Eldritch Knight Bastard sword +3, Magic Drowmesh +3, Iron Armbands of Power (heroic tier)
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======

The basic concept, which I'm sure your character shares, is twofold:

1) Prevent the baddies from hurting your friends. Aegis of Shielding is 5 + con mod damage reduction in heroic, and bumps up to 15 + con mod in paragon with Greater Aegis of Shielding. I'm looking forward to saying, over and over again, "actually, he gets to make that attack with a -3 to hit and -21 damage." Marking 2 enemies at a time (paragon) ups the ante a bit further.

2) Punish the baddies when they come after you, instead. As you've obviously noted, Hellfire Inferno is great - if they come after you, 1d6 + con mod if they hit you. Tack on White Lotus Riposte to add int mod when they come after you. If you curse your mark, you're doing extra curse damage as well.

My plan with the paragon path is to take advantage of the Feytouched L11 feature Slashing Wake, which does int mod damage to all adjacent enemies any time you teleport away. Ethereal Sidestep, the L10 at-will teleport 1, gives you a freebie (and neutralizes restrains, grabs, immobilizes, etc.). That gets dramatically stepped up over the course of paragon with minor teleports at-will (eldritch panoply set), random other free or encounter teleports from items and powers, and planestrider boots (turn any teleport into 2 separate teleports totaling the same distance).

Granted, I haven't tried the character out yet, but I'm excited to take it out for a spin. Hopefully you'll enjoy it, too! It's definitely conceptually sound as a defender with some solid damage output and decent control... I'll be able to offer some more insight later in the week, no doubt

 

[ravenheart]

I am not an expert on the stuff you've listed, as I have no access to swordmages or to vestige pact nor to hybrids, but it would appear your character would be a striking Defender who exerts a bit of control.

You would want to be continually moving about the battlefield, smiting your enemies and running away (for the concealment Warlock benefit) forcing them to attack a concealed defender who can hit hard, or strike at an enemy and do hardly anything.

Since your group is atypical and not built around 'optimization' so much, I would imagine your DM will not throw encounters that force a typical group in so much, allowing you to shine as much as your fellows, from what I could see.

But, I really hardly know anything except that Swordmages(Aegis anyway) tend to mark then run away and fight something else, and that Warlocks get harder to hit when they're moving.

Hybrid Warlocks don't get Shadow Walk unfortunately, and I used Hybrid Talent to get Swordmage Warding (need that +3 to AC if I'm gonna defend anything at all!). The point about the Twofold Pact was that it probably isn't legal, since it would basically grant me a class feature (Eldritch pact at-will and pact boon) I had to give up as a Hybrid.

I'm starting to get a bit worried that I'm gonna be able to hit anything at all, actually, since my attacks vs AC/NADs is +11/+9 at this point (going for Focused expertise next level). The party is melee heavy though, and CA is sure to some up some of the time. But still, too low?

I think you're right in looking at a defender with some cross-role flavor. Controllers are always nice to have, but never really vital.

That looks pretty similar to a Swordmage|warlock I'm going to be using for an upcoming short-term adventure. We're going to be playing in paragon, which is where the build really comes into its own. It certainly looks viable before that, though. I'm working with fey pact in order to grab the feytouched paragon path. Admittedly, that's mostly for the numbers game, as I'm looking at a short-term game. Here's the setup, with two extra items added as a proof of concept:

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Roy Tayburn, level 14
Human, Swordmage|Warlock, Feytouched
Hybrid Talent: Swordmage Warding
Swordmage Aegis (Hybrid): Aegis of Shielding
Eldritch Pact (Hybrid): Fey Pact (Hybrid)
Eldritch Strike: Eldritch Strike Constitution
Hybrid Warlock: Hybrid Warlock Reflex
Twofold Pact: Infernal Pact

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 13, Con 22, Dex 9, Int 20, Wis 11, Cha 13.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 12, Con 16, Dex 8, Int 16, Wis 10, Cha 12.


AC: 31 Fort: 28 Reflex: 29 Will: 25
HP: 100 Surges: 13 Surge Value: 25

TRAINED SKILLS
Intimidate +13, Bluff +13, Arcana +17, Endurance +18

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +6, Diplomacy +8, Dungeoneering +7, Heal +7, History +12, Insight +7, Nature +7, Perception +7, Religion +12, Stealth +6, Streetwise +8, Thievery +6, Athletics +8

FEATS
Human: Hybrid Talent
Level 1: Weapon Proficiency (Bastard sword)
Level 2: Weapon Focus (Heavy Blade)
Level 4: White Lotus Riposte
Level 6: White Lotus Defense (retrained to Greater Aegis of Shielding at Level 11)
Level 8: Mark of Warding
Level 10: Toughness (retrained to Starfire Womb at Level 12)
Level 11: Twofold Pact
Level 12: Greater Swordmage Warding
Level 14: Double Aegis
Feat User Choice: Focused Expertise (Bastard sword)

POWERS
Bonus At-Will Power: Eyes of the Vestige
Hybrid Swordmage at-will 1: Sword Burst
Hybrid Warlock at-will 1: Eldritch Strike
Hybrid encounter 1: Chains of Levistus
Hybrid daily 1: Armor of Agathys
Hybrid utility 2: Dimensional Warp
Hybrid encounter 3: Dimensional Vortex
Hybrid daily 5: Swordmage Shielding Fire
Hybrid utility 6: Fey Switch
Hybrid encounter 7: Rejuvenating Strike
Hybrid daily 9: Glamor Blade
Hybrid utility 10: Etheral Sidestep
Hybrid encounter 13: Seed of Fire (replaces Rejuvenating Strike)

ITEMS
Cloak of Translocation +3, Circlet of Indomitability (heroic tier), Escape Tattoo (heroic tier), Blackleaf Gloves (heroic tier), Belt of Breaching (paragon tier), Planestrider Boots (paragon tier), Eladrin Ring of Passage (paragon tier), Blade of the Eldritch Knight Bastard sword +3, Magic Drowmesh +3, Iron Armbands of Power (heroic tier)
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======

The basic concept, which I'm sure your character shares, is twofold:

1) Prevent the baddies from hurting your friends. Aegis of Shielding is 5 + con mod damage reduction in heroic, and bumps up to 15 + con mod in paragon with Greater Aegis of Shielding. I'm looking forward to saying, over and over again, "actually, he gets to make that attack with a -3 to hit and -21 damage." Marking 2 enemies at a time (paragon) ups the ante a bit further.

2) Punish the baddies when they come after you, instead. As you've obviously noted, Hellfire Inferno is great - if they come after you, 1d6 + con mod if they hit you. Tack on White Lotus Riposte to add int mod when they come after you. If you curse your mark, you're doing extra curse damage as well.

My plan with the paragon path is to take advantage of the Feytouched L11 feature Slashing Wake, which does int mod damage to all adjacent enemies any time you teleport away. Ethereal Sidestep, the L10 at-will teleport 1, gives you a freebie (and neutralizes restrains, grabs, immobilizes, etc.). That gets dramatically stepped up over the course of paragon with minor teleports at-will (eldritch panoply set), random other free or encounter teleports from items and powers, and planestrider boots (turn any teleport into 2 separate teleports totaling the same distance).

Granted, I haven't tried the character out yet, but I'm excited to take it out for a spin. Hopefully you'll enjoy it, too! It's definitely conceptually sound as a defender with some solid damage output and decent control... I'll be able to offer some more insight later in the week, no doubt

That teleportation trick does sound interesting, and you could switch to Mark of Passage for extra fun! I believe there are other ways to get a -3 mark, at least when you get to epic. Waiting to hear how it went!