what the heck is "dual strike"?

[Kurotowa]

No, you can't do that. Spring Attack allows you to move up to your speed and take an attack action sometime during the move. Dual Strike is a standard action, not an attack action. Hence, Dual Strike and Spring Attack cannot be combined.

I'm discovering that D&D is really not big on allowing you to combine special actions. I suppose it makes sense from the point of view of wanting to prevent abuse. But it does stiffle inventive thinking just a little. It seems as if the accepted method to do something new is to create a new PrC with a new class feature. Like the Tempest PrC which lets you make attacks with two weapons on a Sping Attack. Nice, but was there no other way than taking 5 levels of a PrC?

 

[FireLance]

I'm discovering that D&D is really not big on allowing you to combine special actions. I suppose it makes sense from the point of view of wanting to prevent abuse. But it does stiffle inventive thinking just a little.

The solution is to get a DM who is willing to ignore what the rules say if it's going to result in a more enjoyable game for everyone (and I mean everyone: you, the DM, and the other players in your group - expecting the rules to change when it will result in less fun for your fellow gamers is simply selfish, in my view).

The rules are kind of like an off-the-rack suit or pre-made spaghetti sauce. They work well enough "as is" for most of us, but you can probably make them work better for you if you spend a little time and effort.

 

[Nim]

Spring Attack only allows the "attack action", which is a type of standard action. Dual Strike is its own standard action, it is not the "attack action".

Same reason why Shot On The Run and Manyshot don't add up.

On the other hand, Flyby Attack and Dual Strike will work just fine together. Hmmmm.....

 

[Klaus]

Notice that FlyBy Attack does NOT remove the Attack of Opportunity from moving. Adroit FlyBy Attack (Draconomicon, IIRC) does, though.

 

[RigaMortus2]

Just want to add that you can also Ready a Dual Strike. You can't Ready more than 1 attack w/o using something like Dual Strike.

 

[billd91]

Hi Guys,

Just thought i'd join the Dual Strike debate...

Surely If you take Dual Strike AND Spring Attack you can do this:

a). Move before and after the attack as a MOVE ACTION (Spring Attack)

AND

b). Attack once with both your primary and off hands as a standard Action (DUAL STRIKE)

If you didn't have Dual Strike you could only attack ONCE as an Attack Action (ie. a Standard Action) with Spring Attack

What you're running into is poor use of terminology on WotC's part. The same thing happens with Manyshot.

Spring Attack and Shot on the Run both specifically say attack action while both Manyshot and Dual Strike say standard action. But, in both cases of spring attacking and taking a shot on the run, since a move action must be accomplished that round, the attack action you're taking is also a standard action.

Manyshot and Dual Strike require standard actions, and since they are attacks they are clearly attack actions. So it looks like they should be useable in combination, right?

No. The designers have clarified the situation that, for the purposes of these feats, the standard action required by Manyshot and Dual Strike is not the same as the attack action described in Shot on the Run and Spring Attack. But your interpretation of the rule is certainly an understandable deviation from the designers' intentions.