D&D General what would a good orc culture be like?

Warpiglet-7

Cry havoc! And let slip the pigs of war!
See this is why I read ENWorld.

I normally like traditional orcs. But I just got pumped thinking about a good orc nation in my campaign world.

Maybe evict some of Dragonborn space a bit and see the surprise of long term players when they enter the gates of this nation
 

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Blue Orange

Gone to Texas
I look at Tolkien's conception of orcs as industrial and clever with technology and wonder....
Very good point! Forgot one but it is worth mentioning.

Kirill Yeskov's The Last Ringbearer, which you have to find samizdat (heh) translations of on the web, is an unauthorized Tolkien fanfic/interpretation by a Russian fellow which has the orcs as the industrially minded victims of a reactionary, archaic, racist elven conquering force. It's a perspective flip on Lord of the Rings.

This wiki entry might give enough detail to be a jumping-off point:


(Depressingly necessary disclaimer: I oppose Russia's invasion of Ukraine.)
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
Team Gruumsh World Police.
Gruumerica
Gruumerica

Gruumerica, orc yeah!
Coming again to save the greataxe loving day, yeah
Gruumerica, orc yeah!
Freedom is the only way, yeah

Demon prince your game is through cuz now you have to answer to
Gruumerica, orc yeah!
So lick my axe and suck on my mauls
Gruumerica, orc yeah!
What you gonna to do when we charge at you now!

It's the passion that we all share
It's the RAGE for tomorrow
ORC YEAH!

Primal Spirits, orc yeah!
Axe-Mart, orc yeah!
Barbarians, orc yeah!
Football, orc yeah!
 

EzekielRaiden

Follower of the Way
It's weird that we don't want to paint races as singular cultures with innate morality and species wide personality traits, until we do.
I mean, in general I don't. I prefer polyracial cultures and racial polyculture (that is, Cultures A, B, and C include people of diverse racial origin, and Races I, II, and III do not each have only one culture but are found among many cultures.)

But the request was given and I felt like participating. It also seemed, to me, like an opportunity to have more than one "orcish" culture, a contrast between the cliche and often disappointing one we usually get and an alternative that is much more interesting and even laudable.

Hobgoblins have been the militarized lineage in the past I thought?

b9a.jpg
All cultures get stereotyped by outsiders. The issue becomes whether we as creators limit a culture to its stereotype(s), or fully flesh out their culture and recognize the stereotype(s) as outsiders having a flawed and incomplete understanding of the culture in question.
 

Yeah but the question isn't whether a culture purports to embrace those values (spoiler: most say they do) but rather can a culture actually do that (spoiler: none has yet).

We're talking a fantasy world. Celestials (for example) would be a culture that does exactly that.

I disagree on the Klingons as an example of Good Orcs. Lawful Orcs perhaps, but not 'Good'.
 


Mind of tempest

(he/him)advocate for 5e psionics
I mean, in general I don't. I prefer polyracial cultures and racial polyculture (that is, Cultures A, B, and C include people of diverse racial origin, and Races I, II, and III do not each have only one culture but are found among many cultures.)

But the request was given and I felt like participating. It also seemed, to me, like an opportunity to have more than one "orcish" culture, a contrast between the cliche and often disappointing one we usually get and an alternative that is much more interesting and even laudable.


All cultures get stereotyped by outsiders. The issue becomes whether we as creators limit a culture to its stereotype(s), or fully flesh out their culture and recognize the stereotype(s) as outsiders having a flawed and incomplete understanding of the culture in question.
I think you kinda need to know what the origin cultures for the races are as to be able to build polyculture from their base components.
 

EzekielRaiden

Follower of the Way
I think you kinda need to know what the origin cultures for the races are as to be able to build polyculture from their base components.
Howso?

In FFXIV, for example, we do not have access to the "traditional" or "original" culture of several groups. Sometimes, it is because those cultures no longer exist, e.g. the modern city of Ul'dah was founded by a lalafell (halfling) majority culture called Belah'dia, but Belah'dia ceased to exist over a thousand years ago and all we have left are some ruins of their religious and political structures. The modern culture of Ul'dah features mostly hyur (humans), lalafells, and roegadyn (effectively orcs), while having relatively few elezen (elves) and miqo'te ("catgirl/catboy" types, as opposed to Khajiit-like humanoid cats.) Similarly, lalafells in general originally come from the south sea isles, demonstrating a form of insular dwarfism most likely, but the south sea isles are not accessible to players so we don't know what their culture is like in specific. As a result, we know that there are and have been multiple lalafell-majority cultures, and that lalafells exist in many cultures (though not all cultures) of the present day, without actually knowing much if anything about any "original" culture they may have possessed.

I don't see why it cannot be the same for a D&D game. It might be the case that there was in fact one single ancestral culture from which all modern cultures descend, but that culture may be inaccessible by reasons of time or geography.
 

Howso?

In FFXIV, for example, we do not have access to the "traditional" or "original" culture of several groups. Sometimes, it is because those cultures no longer exist, e.g. the modern city of Ul'dah was founded by a lalafell (halfling) majority culture called Belah'dia, but Belah'dia ceased to exist over a thousand years ago and all we have left are some ruins of their religious and political structures. The modern culture of Ul'dah features mostly hyur (humans), lalafells, and roegadyn (effectively orcs), while having relatively few elezen (elves) and miqo'te ("catgirl/catboy" types, as opposed to Khajiit-like humanoid cats.) Similarly, lalafells in general originally come from the south sea isles, demonstrating a form of insular dwarfism most likely, but the south sea isles are not accessible to players so we don't know what their culture is like in specific. As a result, we know that there are and have been multiple lalafell-majority cultures, and that lalafells exist in many cultures (though not all cultures) of the present day, without actually knowing much if anything about any "original" culture they may have possessed.

I don't see why it cannot be the same for a D&D game. It might be the case that there was in fact one single ancestral culture from which all modern cultures descend, but that culture may be inaccessible by reasons of time or geography.

I love FFXIV, but I also have to say that several of the player species seem a tad unmoored and lacking identity beyond visuals. For example I really don't see there being much meaningful difference between the elezen and the hyur.
 

EzekielRaiden

Follower of the Way
I love FFXIV, but I also have to say that several of the player species seem a tad unmoored and lacking identity beyond visuals. For example I really don't see there being much meaningful difference between the elezen and the hyur.
Elezen live about 33% to 50% longer (reaching 120 is quite common for them, and they don't achieve full physical maturity until their early 20s.) It is not too weird for an elezen to reach 150. That alone has a big impact. It's part of why Gridania is so horribly racist, and part of why both Ishgard and (to a lesser extent) Gridania are so isolationist.
 

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