D&D 5E What's the point of gold?

Is it more realistic to expect to live off the dragon's hoard for the test of your life as principal or as capital? Classically, even Aladdin had to keep summoning the genie for more golden platters to sell. It would seem more in keeping with the actual economies to ask "how much gold does it take to buy an inn/start a manufactory/buy a patent of nobility and land and 10,000 serfs to work the land?"

But I agree that a mere dragon hoard is unlikely to do the job. Seems fair though since D&D dragons are 100x wimpier than Smaug, they should also have 100x less treasure.

P.S. Saving a princess from the dragon and then marrying into royalty is still totally fair game though.
 

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Tracking stuff like that varies between groups and games. Heck, how much I track varies depending on the theme of the campaign.

Here's an RPG principle: zoom in on whatever is a significant, immediate conflict for the main characters, and handle it in fine detail. Everything else, handle with less granularity of resolution, or just handwave.

1E D&D assumes that fights with monsters or with rival humanoids will be a significant, immediate conflict for the main characters, and so it has lots of rules for what EXACTLY happens when you attack someone with a bec-de-voulge-guisarme and they're wearing banded mail. (There's a table with modifiers for every weapon, vs. each type of armor, in the original DMG, so that plate mail is great against swords but less so against warhammers. I never saw anyone use that table.)

It also has NO generalized core rules for perception checks. There's a rule specific to finding hidden doors, with a modifier if you're an elf. There's a skill for finding traps, which does not interact at all with your chance of spotting a hidden door. And in the monster manual, under Yeti, there's a rule specific to spotting yetis hiding in snow. Because hiding on a same-color background is done only by yetis, and not by any other species, natural or otherwise.

Starvation, which I'd bet had killed more humans than armed conflict, at least up to Elizabethan times? Not a significant, immediate conflict under consideration, which makes sense in context. So no rules.

If *all you care about is resolving the outcome of fights*, this is appropriate game design. If you want three pillars, then you shift the rule design accordingly.

A want a set of rules which supports BOTH handwaving AND close-in, fine-detail resolution, on any topic, depending on the themes and specifics of the story at the moment.

When the story is about finding the Amulet of Plot Significance, which is buried on a mummified corpse under a pyramid, then you take a caravan from Starting City to Pyramid Location, it takes you a week, got any specific plans for that week of travel? you're practicing the flute and chatting up the dwarf? fine, so noted. Foreshadowing is established for the pyramid trap with a musical solution, and for the moment when the dwarf figures out the sloping tunnel trap and can only save one of the PCs. This occupies one week of the character's lifetime - and half an hour of player's session, at most. The first hour that the characters spend in the pyramid, however, is played out during two hours of the player's session time.

When the story is about solving a mystery when one of the NPC caravan travelers dies (Murder on the Silk Road), okay, THEN you play out that caravan journey in detail, day by day. Camels, dromedaries, horses, mules? Are you riding them, or leading them while on foot? Are you following a river, or going from oasis to oasis, hoping the water doesn't run out? Who's watching out for bandits, and are you leaving a trackable set of footprints and hoofprints? Are you wearing heavy armor all day long, and what's the exhaustion cost for that?

Spending an hour of session time on those topics, in the Pyramid Amulet Quest, is not worthwhile. But when days 1-3 of the caravan journey are setup for what happens on day 4, then those topics ARE worth an hour, because they affect who's where, and who has whose trust, and who's ready for combat, at noon on day 4.

Same rules system, same gaming group, same campaign, *different story*.

Which means that rules for the specifics of caravans should be *available* and not *mandatory*.

Bonus points if you can apply this principle to spending gold on magic and on nonmagic items!
 
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But I agree that a mere dragon hoard is unlikely to do the job. Seems fair though since D&D dragons are 100x wimpier than Smaug, they should also have 100x less treasure.

Most DnD Dragons do not get taken out by one shot though.

Smaug was over rated.
 

1E D&D assumes that fights with monsters or with rival humanoids will be a significant, immediate conflict for the main characters, and so it has lots of rules for what EXACTLY happens when you attack someone with a bec-de-voulge-guisarme and they're wearing banded mail. (There's a table with modifiers for every weapon, vs. each type of armor, in the original DMG, so that plate mail is great against swords but less so against warhammers. I never saw anyone use that table.)

It also has NO generalized core rules for perception checks. There's a rule specific to finding hidden doors, with a modifier if you're an elf. There's a skill for finding traps, which does not interact at all with your chance of spotting a hidden door. And in the monster manual, under Yeti, there's a rule specific to spotting yetis hiding in snow. Because hiding on a same-color background is done only by yetis, and not by any other species, natural or otherwise.
It's worth noting that you received experience for gold pieces gained not monsters defeated. So you were encouraged to get the treasure not stomp the monster. Which does greatly change the tone of the game.
 

That's kind of like praising Microsoft for the bold step of creating a Graphical User Interface with Windows OS. Yes, a good thing, but they're not exactly the first one to ever do it.

It's a good step, I agree there, but it's only now catching up to GURPs, Hero System, and Chaosium's "Basic Role Playing", core rules engines which can drive the setting of your choice, sold separately from the various setting-appropriate add-on packages. Those were around in the 1980s. There are more now.

DM option to build own world is a good thing. Published materials for established settings are also a good thing.

It is true they aren't the first, but they're the biggest. When the 800lb gorrilla changes direction it can change the landscape of an industry. The smaller companies may do it first, but they don't make it mainstream. Another thing to consider is that the big companies often play things a little safer. They don't have the flexability to adapt as quickly so when they make a major change it's a big gamble. To use your example of microsoft, they gambled on the new UI and it's not going well from what I've seen. Had it been a hit you would be seeing other companies switching their stuff to mimic it. But there isn't much in the line of competition for operating systems so it's not the best analagy.

When DnD changes direction it riples through the entire RPG community. Just look at the OGL/GSL. OGL went over well and created revelutionized the industry. The GSL didn't and died a slow quiet death. If 5e continues to grow the way it has, I expect to see more companies offering a more basic starting world for the D/GM to customize. The smaller companies that have built themselves on a particular world may not follow suit, but they're game is built around their world so it makes sense for them not to, but the bigger games probably will.
 

It is true they aren't the first, but they're the biggest. When the 800lb gorrilla changes direction it can change the landscape of an industry. The smaller companies may do it first, but they don't make it mainstream. Another thing to consider is that the big companies often play things a little safer.

Yeah, those are all true and relevant. Steve Jackson Games is a big name within boardgames and RPGs, but Hasbro is a big name on a much larger scale.

Last I checked, graphical user interfaces had become more popular than command-line interfaces; that's not my wheelhouse, so IT industry experts can correct me as needed, or if it's a "depends how you measure" thing. I kinda prefer to have both available on the same screen. In any case, Apple pioneered GUI with the Macintosh, and then Windows boldly followed.
 

It's worth noting that you received experience for gold pieces gained not monsters defeated. So you were encouraged to get the treasure not stomp the monster. Which does greatly change the tone of the game.

I'm not sure how that connects to zooming in and zooming out, some things detailed and some things handwaved, what gets the largest share of game session time?

It does, however, give a motive for looting gold, other than Thaum-Mart. Whether or not you're ever gonna *spend* that gold, you get better at fighting, wizardry, theft or clerical work by *acquiring* it.
 

It's worth noting that you received experience for gold pieces gained not monsters defeated. So you were encouraged to get the treasure not stomp the monster. Which does greatly change the tone of the game.

This could pretty easily be implemented in 5e, if someone wanted to. Have monsters grant only 1/10th their normal xp (IIRC, 1e did grant a little xp for defeating monsters, just not much). Then make up the rest of the xp in gold. Could make for an interesting change in play dynamic, increasing the players' drive to attain the treasure without having to fight the monsters guarding it.
 

I always thought it would be best to have the XP chart numbers also be the wealth by level guidelines. One chart easy to see, and you know how much treasure a monster should have based on it's XP value.
 

But I agree that a mere dragon hoard is unlikely to do the job. Seems fair though since D&D dragons are 100x wimpier than Smaug, they should also have 100x less treasure. P.S. Saving a princess from the dragon and then marrying into royalty is still totally fair game though.
This is 5E, you're supposed to have 6-8 fights per day and they can have multiple dragons in each fight! You'll accumulate more treasure than Smaug ever had in a week hacking and slashing.
 

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