Where did you first see THAC0?

[DMScott]

1ed DMG for me, too - we preferred it to the to-hit charts. To this day, I have trouble taking anyone who describes THAC0 as "complicated" seriously. Compared to all those to-hit tables, or monsters who had AC by location with no system for hitting a particular location, or the original psionics appendix in the PH, or any of a dozen other weird rules quirks in 1ed... THAC0 was a model of simplicity.

 

[JeffB]

What is...Lassiviren the Dark Alex.

Damn that was a cool pic. The book itself was pretty nice too, stats on Bigby, some Lizard Man (another cool pic) a centaur, I think Melf was there...Basically you were peeking in on Gary's campaign.

Ahh good times.

And the Lizard Man was Phoebus..who was human, but died and only a reincarnation spell was available.

I first saw it too in the 1E DMG, but the Thieves Guild books by Gamelords used it quite extensively long before any other AD&D products started ('member those? I still have my second edition Thieves Guild boxed set..unfortunately I cannot find all the original TG products I had..the 3 holepunched ones)

 

[Tonguez]

Um see if I have -2 AC and he has well um nevermind. You'll figure it out after about 10 sessions.

Personally I still can't work out how THAC0 works

But I remember having arguments at school with the kids saying I want to play a halfling theif and me saying but you can't halfling or theif you can't do both! lol that was my transistion to 2e (which I hated btw) - soon after I switched to GURPS.

But 3e+ is wonderful

 

[Vocenoctum]

1ed DMG for me, too - we preferred it to the to-hit charts. To this day, I have trouble taking anyone who describes THAC0 as "complicated" seriously. Compared to all those to-hit tables, or monsters who had AC by location with no system for hitting a particular location, or the original psionics appendix in the PH, or any of a dozen other weird rules quirks in 1ed... THAC0 was a model of simplicity.

I just had this conversation;
"I can't understand why people have so much trouble with THAC0"
"Well, it wasn't very easy to explain"
"What, you prefered the charts?"
"the charts?"
"you never played first edition, did you?"

So, is the THAC0 confusion thing because of 2nd edition? If you'd had to look up charts and such, you'd find THAC0 to be a model of simplicity!

3e really is easier though.

 

[Psion]

1st ed DMG, in the monster reference appendix.

 

[shawnsse]

Been in 3E for more than 3 years now.
Don't remember it was particularly difficult to convert from THACO to BAB.
Anyone find it difficult to convert?

The Armor Class is better as the number get lower in 2E and 1E, 3E has it opposite.

The idea was first introduce in GAMMA WORLD 2E (or 3E?) couldn't get use to it then. But it seems easy when convert to 3E. Don't understand why...

 

[Doc_Klueless]

First Edition DMG in the Monster Summary Tables. Appendix E, I believe.

Me, three.

I know that doesn't add much to the discussion, sooo... I remember thinking at the time "What's this thaco thingy? Eh? Oh, well, I'll just ignore it and use the combat matrixeses (or whatever the plural of matrix is ).

 

[Turgenev]

And the Lizard Man was Phoebus..who was human, but died and only a reincarnation spell was available.

For those who are interested...


[size=-2]Click on image to enlarge[/size]

From left to right: Luthor (6th level Monk; Player - Helen Cook), Phoebus (10th level Fighter; Player - Jeff R. Leason), and Lassiviren the Dark (8th level Assassin; Player - Al Hammack).

What can I say? The Rogues Gallery had some great Jeff Dee art in it.

Cheers,
Tim

 

[Plane Sailing]

... and I think you win the prize for correctly identifying the first products to use THAC0.

UK2 "The Sentinel" was published in 1983 and used THAC0.

However, as I said it was common terminology in amateur press fanzines even before 1e D&D (it was actually easier pre-1e because you didn't have the "hit 6 different AC on a 20" rule).

It definitely predates the 1e DMG.

 

[DMScott]

Been in 3E for more than 3 years now.
Don't remember it was particularly difficult to convert from THACO to BAB.

I was just looking through some archived email, and found one to my D&D group that explained 3E's BAB and AC to them in terms of THAC0 since that's what we were all used to. "See guys, it's not that different from what we're used to..."