D&D 4E Where was 4e headed before it was canned?

[Garthanos]

I cannot type worth beans today I think I will just read

 

[Garthanos]

There is still a general feat that patches it however in a game where general feats are not that valuable.

A feat to provide general competence based on level?

 

[Campbell]

A feat to provide general competence based on level?

Yeah. It adds half level to untrained skills starting at 3rd level. Than full level to untrained skills at 7th level. It's pretty much admission that they wanted to do so anyway. I'll probably just hand it out for free. You already add level to anything that is at least trained and even a fighter will start with 5 trained skills. A Human can push that out to 8 with an Intelligence of 10.

 

[Garthanos]

Yeah. It adds half level to untrained skills starting at 3rd level. Than full level to untrained skills at 7th level. It's pretty much admission that they wanted to do so anyway. I'll probably just hand it out for free. You already add level to anything that is at least trained and even a fighter will start with 5 trained skills. A Human can push that out to 8 with an Intelligence of 10.

Reminds me of some feat taxes introduced in 4e... but nicer since they wanted it off the cuff. Instead of patching something that may not have needed patching (that was a fiasco)

 

[Garthanos]

@Cambell Doesnt that feat smash together trained and untrained at level 7?

Yeah. It adds half level to untrained skills starting at 3rd level. Than full level to untrained skills at 7th level.

 

[Hussar]

Well another difference is 4e's scaling of DC's with PC level.

Kinda sorta. After all, the PC's also scaled their skills by level as well. So, your chances of success remain relatively static. Which is to say that the 5e flat math and the 4e scaling treadmill are essentially the same. You wind up with about a 60% success rate for baseline difficulties. And, to maintain that baseline, we allow higher level characters to attempt more difficult things, thus raising the DC (in 5e I'm talking about) commensurate with the skill level of the character. Thus, retaining that 60% baseline.

There really is no difference.

 

[Garthanos]

There really is no difference.

I called it a bunch of whinging and whining over differences that make no difference....

 

[Hussar]

At Level 1, a 10 is a real challenge: by Level 17, the Rogue is auto-succeeding DC 25.

Unless, of course, the rogue is attempting something outside the DM's Genre Box, in which case he automatically fails because the player apparently doesn't understand the genre conventions that the DM is working from.

And, it's not entirely fair cherry picking the rogue here. That's the rogue's main schtick, that the rogue can reliably perform skill checks. But, only the rogue gets that. Everyone else is stuck using the same formulas.

 

[Imaro]

Heh. You might want to go back and read what I actually wrote. At no point did I claim it was "easily" or "commonly" done in a GoT inspired game. That was 100% you.

I claimed that it COULD be done. And your response was that it was impossible to do parcour in this setting.

I believe that's called a straw man, but, I'm not up on my terms, so, I could be wrong here.

Dude stop misrepresenting what I posted. Again because I already replied once before and corrected you... I said with appropriate training, like that which Arya has gone through, it would be possible.

 

[Hussar]

Ok, so, where did the "easily" or "commonly" come from then? Because I certainly never said it.

So, if you agree that it could be done, then why are you arguing with me?

And, if you agree that it could be done, what would you set the DC as? Let's say the PC wants to move full speed (30 feet I presume) up a vertical wall instead of half speed. What would the DC for that be?

Which was the whole point of what I was talking about in the first place. For some reason you went off on tangents about break dancing and genre conventions. HOnestly, @Imaro, I have zero idea where you are going with this.