While total defensive do you threaten adjacent squares? Flank?

[Methos of Aundair]

This question came up on the WizCo board and I was curious as to the opinions here. If you are in a flanking position and are total defensive do you provide the flanking bonus? While total defensive do you threaten the squares adjacent to you?

 

[The Souljourner]

yup. You always threaten while you're wielding a weapon and aren't held/helpless/unable to act.

-The Souljourner

 

[ForceUser]

yup. You always threaten while you're wielding a weapon and aren't held/helpless/unable to act.

-The Souljourner

Actually, no, you can't. If you open your PHB to page 142 and read the section on Total Defense, the last line reads "You can't make attacks of opportunity while using total defense."

 

[Darklone]

Actually, no, you can't. If you open your PHB to page 142 and read the section on Total Defense, the last line reads "You can't make attacks of opportunity while using total defense."

Right. You can't make AoOs while you are using Total Defense (Probably that's why the poster here asks), but they don't write that you do not threaten the area around. Or do they?

 

[Methos of Aundair]

Originally posted by Darklone

Right. You can't make AoOs while you are using Total Defense (Probably that's why the poster here asks), but they don't write that you do not threaten the area around. Or do they?

That is why I asked and no there is no written statement in the RAW (AFAIK) that states yes or no.

Due to total defense being a standard action you cannot make a melee attack during that round. Due to the restrictions of total defense you cannot make an AoO. By those two statements you can in no way make any type of attack in that round. IMO if you can in no way make any type of attack than you could not possibly threaten your adjacent squares. If you are entirely forbidden from attacking for the entire round how could you possibly threaten? It just doesn’t make sense.

 

[Vrecknidj]

I suppose it all hinges on what "threatens" means.

If you're looking at this from the point of view of the person fighting on Total Defense, then, since he isn't "threatening" anyone, he doesn't threaten anyone.

If you're looking at this from the point of view of the guy who he's in combat against, that other guy doesn't necessarily know that the other person is on Total Defense, and so may feel "threatened" even if he isn't threatened.

If I feel threatened, then maybe I am threatened, even if the person who I think is threatening me isn't really threatening.



Dave

 

[ForceUser]

Total Defense is a standard action and you can't make any attacks at all while executing it. Thus, you do not threaten. Thus, you do not provide a flanking bonus to an ally.

 

[Korak]

I suppose it all hinges on what "threatens" means.
Dave

Threatening a square is defined in the rules. A creature threatens any square into which he can make a melee attack. While using the total defense action, a pc cannot make any melee attacks. Therefore, he/she does not threaten any squares. Thus, he/she cannot provide a flank for an ally.

 

[Methos of Aundair]

According to the glossary description of threaten it states:

Player’s HB Glossary (page 314)

Threaten: To be able to attack in melee without moving from your current space. A creature typically threatens all squares within its natural reach, even when it is not its turn to take an action. …

According to the glossary you threaten if you can make a melee attack. According to the rules of Total Defense it requires a standard action so therefore you cannot make a melee attack due to it being a standard action. According to the description of Total Defense you cannot make any AoO while Total Defensive. According to these two statements you can in no way make a melee attack during a round you are total defensive. So by the definition of threaten in the PHB glossary you do not threaten during total defensive. Remember threaten is defined as being able to make a melee attack.

You realize that by using this logic that if you are flanking someone (normal melee) and you use up all your AoO for the round than according to the definition in the glossary you no longer threaten? And since you no longer threaten you do not provide the flanking bonus anymore? I didn’t realize that.

 

[Methos of Aundair]

Any more thoughts on this?