White Wolf - Yes or no?

[mcrow]

I like Vampire (all editions) Werewolf is OK, don't like Mage, Wraith, or Changling.

The Vampire games I have played in were as angst free as playing a group of vampires can be, we didn't try to be angsty. We had fun and I look forward to the next time I get to play.

 

[Teflon Billy]

I played a lot of Vampire: the Masquerade back in the day and it did not seem to attract "Whiny, Angsty, etc" players at all...the LARP we ran attracted goths, but for the most part they were artistic partiers, rather than mopey loners. I married one

The tabletop game produced almost zero navel-gazing "tragic treatises on the nature of lost humanity" and a lot of "superpowered blood-drinking badasses wage secret war on one another"-type campaigns.

I have nothing but love for the old WoD.

My expeience with the new model is minimal.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

IMHO, the stereotype came from the number of those whinygoths who were attracted to the game, not the game itself.

When I participated in a GURPS V:tM playtest, there was none of the whinygoth stereotype, and all of the high-action mayhem you'd see in a Blade movie.

 

[Ranger REG]

I played a lot of Vampire: the Masquerade back in the day and it did not seem to attract "Whiny, Angsty, etc" players at all...the LARP we ran attracted goths, but for the most part they were artistic partiers, rather than mopey loners. I married one

Um, my condolence? (Isn't that appropriate when married to a goth?)

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Changeling you're playing a fey human hybrid and not a true fey either. It's a different game and that's a good thing.

No, in Changeling (the old, good version ) you are playing a fey that has bonded with a human soul - not quite the same thing. If slain by methods other than Cold Iron the fey portion is reborn, having bonded to a new host (with the obvious exception of the Sidhe - who do not bond with a human host, but displace it), while the human soul goes to wherever human souls go. Much like a horseman changing mounts.

In my estimation the new Storyteller system is a different game, with a core system that is just plain bad, and that is not a good thing. (I have gone on at some length about the whys and wherefores of my disliking the system previously on these forums. I will pass this time around, I think.)

I like many of the changes that they have made to the world, but I despise the system with a passion. I believe that the way clans are handled in the new Vampire to be more balanced. I like the flavor of the Mortal society better, and the fact that you add a template to a mortal in order to get the supernatural creatures. While I do not like the new Werewolf or the new Mage I was not overly fond of the originals either. (Well, I did like Mage: the Sorcerer's Crusade...)The core mechanic of the new WoD is my sticking point.

The changes to Changeling on the other hand just make me think that is a good thing that I have given up on Storyteller. (Though I will admit to curiosity in regards to Monte Cook's World of Darkness.... maybe it will have a system that I can stand.) I would be trading a game system that I like for one that I do not, and in return getting something that I don't want to play.

I will also confess that of the original WoD games Changeling was my favorite, being not so much World of Darkness as World of Adjustable Mood Lighting. While there was indeed some angst the characters were actively fighting against it rather than reveling or wallowing in it.

The Auld Grump

 

[Teflon Billy]

IMHO, the stereotype came from the number of those whinygoths who were attracted to the game, not the game itself...

I don't know. Lots of the "this is how you play" sections by Rein*Hagen made it pretty clear that the Whiny Goth stereotype was the game's intended mode of play.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Heck, the very theme of Vampire was (and is) the struggle against the ravenous beast within. Werewolf was similar, combined with Captain Planet. Mage was about the death of imagination and possibility, as was Changeling.

All of them were capable of having very cool campaigns and games, and indeed, many people played them. But I think a lot of that was despite the designers' intentions, not because of them.

 

[Crothian]

No, in Changeling (the old, good version ) you are playing a fey that has bonded with a human soul - not quite the same thing.

Perhaps, they say a lot of things in the books and it is not all compatiable with what other books say. Many people; have different interpretations on it.

 

[EditorBFG]

Bo, not really - this time you play people being hunted by the fey rather than the being fey yourself, more akin to the fey-touched in D20 than anything else.

This actually makes me happy, because there were a lot of things I liked in the old changeling, but overall it was confusing.

Seemings really were a big part of that. Was your fae self something you turned into, or were you that all the time and the human appearance was an illusion? Were chimerical items always invisible on your person, or only when you were your fae self? What about Treasures, which weren't chimerical? If your fae self had super-powers, why would you ever be in your human self? Did the Attribute modifiers of being, say, a Noble or a Troll apply when you were not in your fae mien? What was the difference between Noble and Commoner reincarnation?

It was just a big mess. Even several of the writers (Wayne Peacock, Deana McKinney, Buck Marchinton) thought so and put out their own web version, Changeling: the Celtic Cycle, which made more sense and was overall better than the real product but narrowed its scope to only Celtic folklore.

A new version, with big changes, would be good.

 

[Crothian]

Here's the way I see and deal with these

Seemings really were a big part of that. Was your fae self something you turned into, or were you that all the time and the human appearance was an illusion?

You are both. But normal people only can see thenormal parts. You can spend a point of glamor and make a roll to make your fey seeming what you look like for everyone for a while.

Were chimerical items always invisible on your person, or only when you were your fae self? What about Treasures, which weren't chimerical?

Chimerical items are always invisible to none fey or people without kenning. Like above you can make them real. But you still act as if you are caring them even though others can't see them or you might get some banality. So, if you have a sword on your belt you might sit ackwardly though no one else can tell why. Items that are not chimerical are as real as a book or a pair of shoes.

If your fae self had super-powers, why would you ever be in your human self? Did the Attribute modifiers of being, say, a Noble or a Troll apply when you were not in your fae mien? What was the difference between Noble and Commoner reincarnation?

If you spend to much time embracing your fey life you go Bedlam and eventually the Dreaming reclaims you and you are lost. I have them apply at all times, it is just easier that way. Sidhe don't get reincarnated, or that is what people think. The reincarnations were poorly explained and there are contradictions.

It can be a big mess. I read through it all and then figured out how it will work for my game that I'm running and once I was able to do that the game was (and is still) very fun and one of my better campaigns.