D&D General Who “owns” a PC after the player stops using them?

[overgeeked]

Well, IMO yes it does in that the same character can't be in two places at once. I'm not talking about making a clone or copy of the character, I'm talking about Jocasta from your world now being Jocasta on my world and not yours.

Nah. There’s an infinite number of Jocastas out there. All minor variants of the same unknown original. They are all unique, independent, and have absolutely zero effect on any other version of the character. See how the problem goes away if you don’t paint yourself into a weird corner with imaginary things?

 

[QuentinGeorge]

Well, this did indeed become an issue with Critical Role and any early player they had to kick out of the show because of his poor behavior. They couldn't use his character going forward (or perhaps they just let him keep it, I don't know all the details). Maybe a better example would be Scott Kurtz retaining all ownership of Binwin Bronzebottom when he left Acquisitions Incorporated. I realize that these games and characters involved shows and products. But with the number of people live streaming their games, I can see issues like these arising. But as it pertains to ones unbroadcast and unpublished home game, I don't see what the cause of action would be. Maybe if the DM held on to the only copy of PC on a paper character sheet, which was created and by the player, if the player actually wanted to bring the DM to court to get it back.

"couldn't use the character". Mate, they killed him off, the characters encountered the body and had a whole episode of how sad it was that he died. (All after the player had left).

Meanwhile the original player claims his character teleported away, so in this case it looks like Mercer took the character in a completely different direction to what the player wanted? I mean, we were told that was what the player wanted, sure...

 

[QuentinGeorge]

Not only do I use ex-players PCs as NPCs in my world, I even let new players reuse characters abandoned by previous players. Never had any issues with it.

 

[Ondath]

Well, IMO yes it does in that the same character can't be in two places at once. I'm not talking about making a clone or copy of the character, I'm talking about Jocasta from your world now being Jocasta on my world and not yours.

But why are you assuming that it's the same character? I feel like it's really obvious that when you take a friend's character as an NPC in your game, what happens is the "clone or copy" situation as you describe it. Unless the DM who used that character has an insane multiverse theory that their game is always interconnected with all the other D&D worlds and your PC was literally plopped down from their home world and transported into theirs, what you have is always a copy or clone situation. Nobody that I know who uses inspirations from other worlds or games says that the character they are expying literally got plopped from another world. Why are you treating that as the primary case of PC-inspired-NPC when it is obvious that the clone or copy scenario is actually the most common one?

 

[Yaarel]

The similar persons from "parallel timelines" is an established trope. Nevertheless.

In every game I have ever played in, when player characters move from one setting to an other setting, it is always the actual characters. They step thru some kind of threshold, and vanish from one setting and emerge in the new setting. The continuity is vital.

 

[TwoSix]

The similar persons from "parallel timelines" is an established trope. Nevertheless.

In every game I have ever played in, when player characters move from one setting to an other setting, it is always the actual characters. They step thru some kind of threshold, and vanish from one setting and emerge in the new setting. The continuity is vital.

But are the same players and DMs involved here? I think that's pretty crucial to the understanding.

IMX, different DMs are always different universes and different continuities, unless there's been an agreement otherwise that multiple campaigns will be continuous within the same multiverse.

 

[Maxperson]

Well, yes it does if there's only one Gorax.

It's a question of treating the characters as if they are real people.

That's not the question. It's a question of whether or not we treat our worlds as being a part of the same cosmos or not. They aren't. I can remove entire planes of existence from my game that you have in yours. My prime is not your prime. My astral is not your astral. You may have an abyss and I may have axed it from existence.

In short my game is not your game, so Gorax can exist in both and be treated as real people in each. There's still only one Gorax.

The exception is if the different DMs have agreed to run the same cosmos, in which case what you are saying would apply.

Edit: And as far as treating them as real people, that should apply to NPCs as well, no? There are tens of thousands of tables running the Forgotten Realms, and running it differently. We have 10,000 different Elminsters and Doves running around, or less if someone doesn't like them so they don't exist. We have many different variations of that world, since we don't all run the same events in them.

 

[Maxperson]

I've written thousands of silly poems etc. over the years. Never made a cent off 'em. They still belong to me, though.

There's a difference between you writing a poem all by yourself and you creating a character in a shared space. When you create your character for my game, you do not have 100% say so in that creation. As the DM I have the ability to tell you that no you can't be an elf since elves don't exist in my world. Your background, if any, has to be worked into the world that I am running. If you have any special ideas for your character that you want to happen, you have to run it by me and work it out. That ability means that the DM has a small measure of creative control over that PC.

If it makes you guys feel better, think of the PC like a business. You have 95% ownership of it, but I own 5% as a silent partner granted to me by the creative control that I have during character creation. So long as you are in my game, you control what your PC does and says. If you leave my game, that character remains in my world as an NPC since there is no longer a player playing it and my 5% ownership gives me the ability to take it over.

 

[Yaarel]

But are the same players and DMs involved here? I think that's pretty crucial to the understanding.

IMX, different DMs are always different universes and different continuities, unless there's been an agreement otherwise that multiple campaigns will be continuous within the same multiverse.

Some are setting shifts are player characters involving the same DM or the same shared world of several DMs. The shift of at least one character involves unrelated DMs, and in this case all the DMs leave the nonadventuring player characters alone, so there is no problem, and mentioning the character is now in an other world is enough.

 

[Yaarel]

There's a difference between you writing a poem all by yourself and you creating a character in a shared space. When you create your character for my game, you do not have 100% say so in that creation. As the DM I have the ability to tell you that no you can't be an elf since elves don't exist in my world. Your background, if any, has to be worked into the world that I am running. If you have any special ideas for your character that you want to happen, you have to run it by me and work it out. That ability means that the DM has a small measure of creative control over that PC.

If it makes you guys feel better, think of the PC like a business. You have 95% ownership of it, but I own 5% as a silent partner granted to me by the creative control that I have during character creation. So long as you are in my game, you control what your PC does and says. If you leave my game, that character remains in my world as an NPC since there is no longer a player playing it and my 5% ownership gives me the ability to take it over.

I dont understand this view of DMs assuming they own other peoples characters.

I am the DM. I can create whatever NPC I desire. I can draw inspiration and good ideas from any player character that I have seen played, to create a new NPC.

Why would I want to mess around with someone elses personal space that the reallife player self-identifies with? It seems gratuitously cruel and inherently violating.

A player character belongs 100% to the player.