D&D General Who is this made for (Not Beginners) - the New D&D Starter Set

[bedir than]

If the 2014 starter set had cost $50 and was full of all this new stuff I still would not have bought it, because no starter set should cost equal to or greater than its PH IMO. I care about pages of information and variety in play options, and starter sets have a lot less of that, so to me they should cost a lot less (like LMoP). Being a better teaching tool does not make up for that lack of game content, such that having them be the same price would be acceptable to me. I have taught many players how to play different games, and it is always through either the core rules or a reasonably priced starter set.

Yes, but as you know because we've discussed it, this is the new way Starter Sets are -- including for your favorite version of D&D.

 

[Charlaquin]

I've seen that happen. A lot, actually! I've had players insist that a spell doesn't have a Saving Throw when I ask which Save it is, and read it multiple times like you describe, until I take their sheet (I make sheets for players that have the full text of spells, shortened to reduce word-count, but still maintain all that it does) and read it myself, only to discover, it says right there it's a WIS SAVE (or whatever).

I agree with you that they're not doing it on purpose! It's a strange phenomenon.

Like I don't judge our OP for the trouble they had (even if I disagree with their conclusions), I don't judge the player for it - but it can be a tad frustrating!

It doesn’t help that spell descriptions in 5e have a ton of low-information text in them. I know 4e spell/power cards are unpopular around these parts, but they never had this problem. You didn’t have to read through a block of fluffy text to find the one piece of information you were looking for, like the type of save, because it was consistently laid out, clearly labeled, and concisely written.

 

[Mannahnin]

But it's not equivalent to a PHB. It's equivalent to a Starter Version of the PHB, DMG, MM, and an Adventure, plus character sheets, minis, dice, and battle maps!

Exactly. It's chock full of other stuff besides the rules.

For comparison, the 1983 Mentzer Basic set which also only covered levels 1-3 had an MSRP of $12, which is roughly what the AD&D 1E PH cost at the time. Though of course you'd need the DMG as well to even make characters for 1E.

Mentzer Basic had dice and two books including two tutorial solo adventures and a short intro dungeon. The books might be more comprehensive, but the set didn't have character sheets, tokens, or all those (full color) maps!

The 1981 Basic set went for $8.95 or $8.99 in '81, which was about a dollar less than the PH, but it also had a single book and a shorter module instead of two full books like Mentzer.

The 1991 black box "new, easy to master" D&D starter set had an MSRP of $20, which is also what the AD&D PH sold for at the time.

I suspect if we compare across the years, the 2014 starter set is going to stand out as an exception to the rule, being a super-cheap loss leader (IIRC the 4E Essentials one was as well).

 

[Maxperson]

Specifically the module, not the starter set itself. Why choose a remake of B2 if not to catch the attention of older players?

Both? It's designed to capture new players, and entice old players who aren't familiar with the new rules to come back. Or at least it should be designed that way.

 

[cranberry]

Both? It's designed to capture new players, and entice old players who aren't familiar with the new rules to come back. Or at least it should be designed that way.

Honestly, I'd be "afraid" to play the remake. Throughout the entire game I'd be comparing the new and original in my mind.

 

[Neonchameleon]

But it's not equivalent to a PHB. It's equivalent to a Starter Version of the PHB, DMG, MM, and an Adventure, plus character sheets, minis, dice, and battle maps!

This. Unless it's a 'shelf book' the target audience then it's kids who want to teach themselves to play - or parents and uncles and aunts to buy for those kids.

If I'm teaching newbies I don't need this box - and I jump everyone straight into play with a tailored level zero adventure.

 

[Mannahnin]

This. Unless it's a 'shelf book' the target audience then it's kids who want to teach themselves to play - or parents and uncles and aunts to buy for those kids.

If I'm teaching newbies I don't need this box - and I jump everyone straight into play with a tailored level zero adventure.

Yup. Though if you're interested in running KotB, all the maps and goodies in the box might tempt you into the purchase.

 

[Maxperson]

What I mean is, if the starter set doesn't do it for them, they have no motivation to learn about D&D from any other source.

That's really not for you to say. For a new player who didn't really want to play it in the first place, but is doing it because some friends want to try it, he might not have motivation to look further. For someone who wants to learn to play D&D, though, if they don't understand something they are going to Google it, which will bring up all sorts of stuff. They do have motivation to look further.

 

[Micah Sweet]

But it's not equivalent to a PHB. It's equivalent to a Starter Version of the PHB, DMG, MM, and an Adventure, plus character sheets, minis, dice, and battle maps!

Yeah. The PH has much more content as far as I'm concerned, and is therefore worth more of my money.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I didn't buy the A5e starter set either, if that's what you're referring to. Does it cost the same as the Adventurer's Guide?