Who "Owns" Old PC's?

[Desdichado]

It's funny that I hear gamers who strive to "make art" out of their games are labelled pretentious here. To me, the pretentious ones were the ones that made art something exclusive. People who say pop music, genre fiction, comercial illustrations, ...or roleplaying games can't be art because they lack some kind of purity of "true art." Now that's pretentious.

 

[aurin777]

I say the right of the PC can go one of two ways:
---1) The PC belongs to whomever supplied the paper and pencil to create him on. Then, the character is legally whoever owns the sheet.
---2) The character is a part of the DM's world. It seems to me, that that character, and all likeness of him then belong inside that world. Also, if they can't compromise, I say duel custody. The DM gets him on weekends and christmas, the player gets him all other major hollidays and the workweek. The Player must then give the DM character support to the tune of 250 gps a month for lodging and food.
This case is dismissed. Now grow up.
~~~Brandon

 

[Templetroll]

Several characters in my campaign happily provided me with info so that I could use their characters as NPCs. They generally enjoyed watching me try to play 'their' characters.

I always took it as an honor that a DM ran one of my characters as an NPC for a different group of players. On one occasion, we went to visit an old gaming buddy in Florida and his current group was almost in awe at meeting the players who had developed that group's most entertaining NPCs. It was totally geeky but ego-burnishing, nonetheless.

 

[Sagan Darkside]

Re: Re: Who "Owns" Old PC's?

In over 2 years, this is the Wrongest thing I've yet read.

Heh, Repear, you are one of my favorite posters.

On the subject at hand- My players and I are telling a story together. If a player drops out, then why should they care what I do with the story? They are no longer involved.

I am not going to rewrite my campeign world because they wish their character never existed (though, sometimes I wish that, heh).

On the same token, if they want to leave and use my homebrew world of the moment for their own group.. I wish them all the luck in the world.

Its a game. Good Grief.

SD

 

[Leopold]

where's edena?

 

[Mercule]

Which of these definitions would art fall in ?

If painting the Madonna in elephant dung is art, then roleplaying sure better qualify as art.

There's enoug "art" out there that's questionable (I still don't get Picasso) that it's a pretty broad statement.

Regardless, roleplaying is art in the same category as literature or playwriting.

 

[jdavis]

I hope there is _some_ qualification to this. I'd not be very happy (as player or DM) if I was in a game where the DM said "The orc hits you for 5 damage," and the player said, "I don't think so."

I don't think this is what you're talking about, but it's always good to know.



Up until this last bit, I can agree with you almost 100%.

Honestly, I'd have just the opposite reaction. If the DM doesn't have the decency to incorporate my character in a meaningful way in his campaign world, why should I bother. It's just a beer and pretzels game. On the other hand, if my character has the chance to become a real, meaningful figure in the game world then I'm going to put a lot more effort into it.

Basically, if the DM is willing to step up to the task, so am I. If he isn't, then neither am I. I refuse to roll a boulder up hill.

If you mean that the DM has stated that the character will become entirely his and you lose all control over it, then I can definitely see your point. See my previous post about perpetual PCdom.

It's all about incentive. The player needs to feel like he is doing something more than contributing to the DM's pet project. The DM needs the incentive to make his world available as a living, growing entity.

Wow I'm like two pages behind here. I agree with you, My statements were a little heavy but the basic point I was trying to make was that if I go through all the trouble to make a character that's purpose seems to be to give the DM a NPC that he can use later then I really wouldn't care as much about the character as one that was 100% mine. I normally don't mind if my characters live on in the game, but what if my character showed up and did something so wrong or out of place that he would never of done if I was playing him? What if I wanted my character to just retire into obscurity, but hten later found out that against my wishes he had been brought back to start adventuring again as a NPC, or had been killed in a battle or had become a King somewhere, or any of a thousand things that were not "my character retires into obscurity and lives out the rest of his life in wealth and comfort." Lets say you wnated to go drag racing but your car wasn't fast enough, so you came over to my house and took my car to go drag racing with, then when I got mad you said but it's ok I won. Yes that is far fetched but a lot of people take their characters to be as personal if not more personal than their car. Characters being included in the game as NPC's later is fine, but if the player says NO, I don't want you to use him, then that should be the end of it.

 

[jdavis]

No it wasn't a joke thread, I wanted honest opinions about it. This person was really upset and some words were said, and I think also the person might have been pondering revenge or other nasty ways of getting the characters name changed or getting back thier PC, even though they had a copy of it.

It seems a lot of people really don't like DM's reusing thier old PC's I find this a little odd. I always thought and most of my players over the years agreed with me, that most players love when DM's add them into the world and the history of the campaign world changes because of that. Now it seems a lot of PC's don't want change in a DM's world and want thier characters to disappear after a game ends, seems very weird to me cause I care for my world and after gaming in it for over 10 years a lot of changes were made to it by PC's, if I ignore all those changes the world would be really different.

The thing is this isn't a question about a character, it's about respect for the wishes of another person, if he has feelings about it then they should be respected, it doesn't matter what the reasons are, it doesn't matter what anybody here thinks, if he said no then you should respect that he said no and find another way. Can I use your fork? no. Can I use your car? no, can I sleep with your wife? no. Can I use your character as a NPC after he retires? no. It has nothing to do with ownership or if it is a silly question or not, it has to do with respect for the wishes of the other person, it is his right to feel however he wants to on this subject. Seek other options rather than you turning his character into your character. Find a middle ground that doesn't hurt your game world and doesn't hurt his feelings on the matter. That is the end of it.

 

[Quinn]

Who "owns" old PC's? Are we asking from a legal point of view (which is somewhat unfathomable), or strictly from a common sense point of view?

I think common sense would say be a nice guy and don't use the guy's character.

 

[Oaken25]

I never said i'd use some one elses PC, as a PC of my own. I said id use it a copy of it as a NPC, cause it's part of my game world, the character was made for MY game world, and after the game is over that copy of the character is now mine. It was made for my world, it adventured in my world, it is now a NPC in my world. But this does not stop you from using it in some one elses game world, but a copy of it, will exist in my campaign world.

And as I said on the WOTC boards, the game is made between the PC and the DM, it is a joint venture, as some one said earlier, as soon as the PC enters the game it no longer is the same PC, the DM changes it as the game progresses. The DM gives out magic items, gives out spells, gives out plot hooks, etc. It can't be considered just the PC's character any more, cause it is a joint venture between the DM and the PC.

Driving your car, is a lot different then having a character that a DM reuses. And if any thing WOTC is the only one who can claim "ownership" on a character cause we all use THIER books to make characters.