Why _DON'T_ You Buy Dragon Magazine?

[humble minion]

But the Dragon of Fox, Leiber, and Fischer came well before the publishers of Dungeons & Dragons began to create multi-novel lines of books aimed squarely at the interests of D&D's players, using the company's beloved campaign settings as backdrops. Wizards of the Coast publishes scores of fantasy books every year. Some of them reach the New York Times best-seller list. Many of them are branded "Dungeons & Dragons" and hew to the conventions of the game.

If Dragon is to have fiction at all, doesn't it make sense to tie that fiction to the fiction-publishing branch of the Dungeons & Dragons business? There are several other magazines on the market (none of which existed in 1976) poised to publish fantasy by up-and-coming or already popular fantasy authors. But none of those magazines can publish a short story set in Eberron. None of them can run a yarn based on the Red Wizards of Thay. But I can.

This way lieth madness, I think.

Dragon should be about expanding people's horizons of what D&D can be. That's the impression I'm getting from reading all the responses to this thread. People want articles covering overlooked facets of campaign-building, advice on non-standard settings, etc, etc.

Restricting Dragon's fiction to FR and Eberron runs the risk of ghettoising the hobby. You're saying (or at least implying) 'D&D is FR and Eberron'. What you should be doing, in my opinion, is running a piece of good fiction (from whatever source, based in whatever world or milieu), attaching an article on adapting it to D&D rules, and saying "D&D can be this, too."

Fantasy is big, right now. You've got Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings firmly in the mainstream spotlight, plus Narnia and Dark Materials movies coming up. None of these can be comfortably shoehorned into base D&D rules. I want to see D&D (and Dragon) prosper out of this era, not devolve into an insular spell-slots-are-the-only-magic-system, everyone-has-boots-of-speed, every-world-has-paladins-and-beholders backwater.

 

[Acid_crash]

The Martin short story was the only short story I've read in a Dragon Magazine, and when I saw the evil-words-that-are-four-letters-long, I was shocked, amazed, and thought to myself.... Now that's just cool. Why? Because Dragon published a short story written by an author who writes the way he does and didn't censor it. It made it similar to his book series and it fit with the feel of the story he wrote.

To any who had a problem with a couple words, oh well.

As for the magazine itself...if the fiction was reduced to three to four times per year and it was related to existing worlds (FR, Eberron, DL, Dark Sun, etc)... I would have no problem with that.

In the end, the reason why Dragon is selling and Dungeon is not is because the primary purchasers of these magazines are Dungeon Masters and you moved all of the good articules to help with DMs becoming better DMs into Dungeon and left Dragon with useless, mindless, and boring articles with lame fiction and bland writing. It's like, you took the life out of the magazine and put it all in Dungeon... and it seems like you are trying to make up for a couple years of Polyhedron in Dungeon by making Dungeon so great all of a sudden.

So, what are ya gonna do with Dragon?

My suggestion...

put Polyhedron type stuff in with Dragon. Take out the articles on crap that has nothing to do with gaming...we all know what those are, and put in articles that pertains to d20 in general. Paizo owns Dragon, not WotC, so WotC (unless I'm wrong) should have no say as to what gets put into the magazine.

Dungeon should be the DM's magazine, Dragon needs to be the d20 magazine (and also primarily aimed at DM's because they are the ones that say yes or no if something in Dragon is allowed in their games... PLAYERS have NO say in this so don't cater to them).

Repeat:

PLAYERS have NO say in what goes in the game, so DON'T cater to them as much. DM's are the USUAL buyers of your magazines, so cater to them instead.

 

[Turjan]

This way lieth madness, I think.

Restricting Dragon's fiction to FR and Eberron runs the risk of ghettoising the hobby. You're saying (or at least implying) 'D&D is FR and Eberron'. What you should be doing, in my opinion, is running a piece of good fiction (from whatever source, based in whatever world or milieu), attaching an article on adapting it to D&D rules, and saying "D&D can be this, too."

I agree. I can see the reasoning behind the urge to bring some FR or Greyhawk fiction into Dragon: it's the wish to find a niche in the market for Dragon. Dragon cannot compete on fields where other media are better. Printing fiction in D&D worlds is something that is only possible for an official D&D magazine. Then again, I never read any D&D fiction in my whole life, at least not further than a few paragraphs. I don't want to insult anyone, but IMHO most of it is pretty bland. YMMV, as usual. I'm not sure whether I'm a typical Dragon reader in this regard, either. Anyway, my inspiration comes from SF, historical fiction, history sourcebooks, foreign fairy tales, mythology and stuff like that. The fun is to translate these inspirational pieces into my game. I doubt that FR fiction is able to be similarly inspirational, even though I really like the setting.

 

[Jeff Wilder]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but I feel this needs to be responded to. I was taught at a very young age that using vulgarity is not a sign of maturity - being able to express oneself without using vulgarity is.

See, here's the thing ... I didn't say using vulgarity was a sign of maturity. I said handling the use of vulgarity is a sign of maturity.

Feel free to revise your response to address what I actually said, of course.

 

[Jeff Wilder]

Please don't equate us with closed-minded fools who reacted out ignorance and fear.

I honestly can't imagine what other reason you'd have to react in the way TheSigil did.

Personal preference? That's fine. Say so and move on, rather than making ultimatums to the editorial staff.

I agree with you that Erik's approach is the right one ... don't look to include vulgarity, but don't automatically turn away from it, either. Vulgar people behave in vulgar way, and fiction has many and varied reasons to portray vulgar people realistically. Creating a vulgar character who uses curse words is not lazy, habitual, or immature, and assuming it is any of those things -- even allowing for one exception out of a hundred -- is lazy, immature, and probably habitual.

The irony, of course, is that I hate fiction in Dragon, and without fiction, I can't imagine any real reason to include vulgar language.

 

[humble minion]

As an aside on the D&D fiction issue - when has FR or Eberron fiction ever reflected the reality of how the game is played? When was the last time you saw an entire group of fictional characters heading into battle flying, hasted, and invisible? When was the last time a fictional cleric agonised over what spells to prepare, or was left with useless ones at the end of the day? Or when was the last time you saw a character in D&D fiction bedecked with the sort of magic gear (what 10th-level PC mage doesn't own a Headband of Intellect?) that you (and the DMG) would expect a character of his level to own?

D&D fiction can only really be called that if it follows how D&D works. Most 'D&D fiction' as it exists now is just generic swords and sorcery with Faerunian names stuck on with Clag.

 

[Ogrork the Mighty]

I was going to question how someone could have a problem with vulgarity in fiction when they're playing a game that focuses a heck of a lot of attention on killing and looting but, heh, a lot of others have already made the point rather well. We're not living in the 50s anymore. I don't like anyone telling me what I should and shouldn't read; if you don't like it don't read it.

Regarding the inclusion/exclusion of fiction, why not compromise and include it periodically? That would allow the really good stories to continue to be published while not having to put one in every issue. I think fantasy fiction has a place in Dragon, albeit not a primary one. Remember, Dragon magazine can serve as a good jumping off point for authors who might someday become module writers...

 

[IronWolf]

Regarding the inclusion/exclusion of fiction, why not compromise and include it periodically? That would allow the really good stories to continue to be published while not having to put one in every issue. I think fantasy fiction has a place in Dragon, albeit not a primary one.

I agree with Ogrork here. Occasionally including fiction is not that big of deal to me. I enjoy the fiction when it is in there in most cases...

 

[CarlZog]

I'm obscenely late to this party, and my wishes probably contradict most of Dragon's core market, but for whatever it's worth...

I've never been a regular subscriber, but I've read it off and on for many years. I think the first issue I ever bought was somewhere in the 30s. These days, I'll glance at it every now and then on the shelf, but I very rarely buy it. Why?

As others indicated, Dragon has more competition these days, particularly from websites and forums like EnWorld. The "fix" I used to get from Dragon, I get online these days. Likewise, the web offers up endless reams of free material that rivals or bests what Dragon offers.

I'll echo comments that today's Dragon is too dry. This is a hobby, meant to be fun. Dragon doesn't seem to reflect that very well anymore -- either in its editorial mix or in its writing style. Lighten up! This is a problem plaguing D&D in general.

As for the fiction debate, I'd love to see occasional good fiction in Dragon, if it served the purpose of inspiring campaign ideas. Amazing Stories under Kim Mohan fed me with lots of game ideas -- though not much for D&D. I despaired when A.S. folded, and I have little use for its latest incarnation.

I'd prefer Dragon wasn't just D&D. I know the vast majority of folks feel quite the opposite, but I agree with the poster who missed reading about new games in the pages in Dragon, or even discovering new games published in Dragon. (I still have a copy of Orcwars somewhere!) I'd love to see a good, broad-based gaming mag. Or at least a broad-based RPG mag. Tim Kask's Adventure Gaming was my favorite magazine of all time.

I'm also one of the few who thinks Dungeon was awesome when Polyhedron was tagged to it. What a great combo with the d20 mini-games.

These days, I really look forward to the Enworld Player's Journal (now Enworld Gamer). The latest issue (the first under the Gamer title) was a great mix of fun ideas for a variety of rpg genres that kept me glued cover to cover. And the promise of more mini-games has me ready to subscribe. I wish they'd do it more than quarterly.


Carl

 

[Turjan]

I was just reading Dragon 327, which for whatever reason reached me yesterday together with Dungeon 118, and just like to ask whether it is supposed to contain already some of the changes we have to expect?