why are wizards so weak?

[BryonD]

Most (not all) respondents haven't really taken this point into account, but for better or worse it has led to a huge depowering of wizards vis a vis their original role.

This is certainly true. But I consider it a de-ubbering rather than making wizards weak.

Wizards used to have the useless dead weight reputation at early levels, ("Wait, guys I'm gonna cast my one 1st level spell for the day now..." ) and then they became super-powered later on. Now they get enough to be viable at low level and don't blast way off ahead later on. IMO it works very much "good enough".

 

[Dark Jezter]

2e had a very different class balance philosophy than 3e does. In 2e, class balance meant "Mages are weak at low levels, while fighters are strong. At high levels, fighters are weak while mages are demigods." With 3e, class balance has been changed to "classes should keep roughly the same level of usefulness through all levels."

Just based on my own expirience, 3e's balance system does what it set out to do. At low levels, wizards are a lot better than they were in 2e and fighters are still useful. At high levels, I've noticed that wizards & sorcerers usually clear groups very well, but when the group is taking on a single large enemy, the fighters (or barbarian, or paladin) usually end up dealing the most damage over the course of combat.

 

[frankthedm]

Another thing that hurts the potency of direct damage, is when DMs don't put out lowish level mooks in higher level combats. It is bad enought that most monsters keep up with how tough the party has become, but it is down right disheartening when NOTHING ever dies to a fireball or lightning bolt.

 

[Chimera]

Another thing that hurts the potency of direct damage, is when DMs don't put out lowish level mooks in higher level combats. It is bad enought that most monsters keep up with how tough the party has become, but it is down right disheartening when NOTHING ever dies to a fireball or lightning bolt.

Depends greatly on the GM, as I've seen some who did and some who didn't.

I've gotta say that I vastly prefer to play games where we have larger numbers of creatures in an encounter than difficult encounters against one creature. Makes it more fun and seem like more of an accomplishment as we dismantle the enemy. Ah, but that's not the thread topic, is it.


Currently playing a Wizard and my biggest problem is the cost of spells. Buying scrolls and then transcribing them to my spellbook is ridiculous. 125gp for 1st level spells, 350gp per second level (150 for scroll, 200 for scribing). Fortunately, my GM is making it a little easier for me to pick up some spells, but;

[sarcasm]
Golly, just can't wait to be buying higher level spells.
[sarcasm]

And meanwhile, the Cleric gets this great whopping list of spells all for free...

 

[Sejs]

Short answer - it's your players, it's not the class. On several occasions I've seen a well handled wizard carry the nearly the entire fight.

Hmmm...so it seems that the wizard is good for battlefield control, buffing friends, debuffing enemies, etc., but lousy for direct damage.

So I guess it is Evokers that are disproportionally weak?

Well, first off, as the saying goes, He who controls the Earth can conquer Heaven. Battlefield control and debuffing are probably two of the biggest factors in winning a fight, or turning an impossible fight into a managable one.

As for Evokers being disproportionally weak? Absolutly not.

 

[Viktyr Gehrig]

If you really want to give the Wizards a bit of an extra edge, have them automatically specialize in the school of their choice without suffering specialization penalties-- the forbidden schools.

This leaves them in pretty good shape compared to Sorcerors.

 

[kilamanjaro]

I don't use SR against elemenatal evocation spells, I think I got this rule from Unearthed Arcana. It makes the evocation spells a more attractive choice compared to the many damaging conjuration spells.

 

[Thorin Stoutfoot]

And meanwhile, the Cleric gets this great whopping list of spells all for free...

This has been my biggest problem with clerics. Every new spell added suddenly becomes part of their repertoir. In my latest campaign, clerics are now spontaneous casters a la sorceror as per the Unearthed Arcana variant. We'll see how it works out.

 

[Jondor_Battlehammer]

In 2E, saves capped at a certain level, depending on your class. A fireball would still likely cause some damage even to a high level PC. Now, even a fighter will often make his reflex save vs. a low level spell, and a cheap enchantment on his armor will protect him from most of that.

I don't consider Wizards weak, but they have been altered significantly in every edition. This might be part of the reason they seem "nerfed".

 

[Felon]

Why are mages weak?

Because they're so frickin' powerful, that's why.

Give'em d6 hit die, and I'd be satisfied.