Why aren't paladins liked?

[Quasqueton]

I would think that a party of at least nominally heroic adventurers would like the idea of having a paladin in their group -- the epitomy of heroic classes. They are usually trustworthy and dedicated. They are literally fearless and devoted.

But in all my years of playing and DMing D&D, and in reading various forums on D&D, I've never seen anyone actually happy to have a paladin in the group. Usually the big class that everyone wants in their group is a cleric.

The only thing that seems to be really useful to the group as a whole is the paladin's detect evil ability. But from what I've read on this board, many DMs hate this ability, and most Players don't really care or give it a second thought.

Using a computer game as an example, paladins in Diablo II have abilities that boost everyone's powers. A group of adventurers in that game gain a lot of tangible benefits from having a paladin in the group. Allies of a paladin in that game deal more damage, can regenerate, etc.

But in D&D, the closest thing to a party boost the paladin gives is the aura of courage that gives +4 against fear effects to those within 10' of the paladin. Not really a great boon.

So, does the paladin class actually bring anything to a group that is worthwhile? When organizing a new group of adventurers, someone always mentions the need for someone to play a cleric. But too often there are groans of annoyance when someone mentions wanting to play a paladin.

Why isn't the paladin at the top of the list of classes to consider with a group of adventurers?

Quasqueton

 

[Ankh-Morpork Guard]

I think the biggest problem is that most people who play Paladins end up playing them as arrogant jerks who want to tell everyone what to do. I've not had much trouble in the games I run, the PCs don't love Paladins, but they get along with them just fine in the groups.

I don't have a problem with detect evil at all, and in fact, I've used it many times to confuse the Paladin and prove to him that he can't just use it as a "detect and smite" machine without a lot of consequences.

 

[Mouseferatu]

I love paladins. Some of my favorite characters I've ever played were paladins. I think they typify a particular type/feel of fantasy--the truly heroic, high-fantasy ouvre--better than most of the other classes.

Now, that being said, I know why some people object to them. If you're playing in a group that's trying to portray more of the "scoundrel" type, or the "Heck with that honor thing, let's just get the job done" sort of characters, you can run into some conflict. A good roleplaying, combined with an understanding DM, can make a paladin work even in such situations. But since so many people seem to feel the paladin must be played as the arrogant, stick-in-the-mud guy who spends all his free time lecturing his companions, it's easy to see why people develop a misperception regarding the class.

 

[Ferret]

Paladins eat babies. My mommy says thats bad.

 

[BiggusGeekus]

Paladins come with a lot of baggage, some people dislike that baggage. Me? I think paladins are easy to roleplay and easy to build a story arc around.


level roleplay
================
1-5 obnoxious jerk
6-10 doubt sets in
11-15 self loathing
16-20 redemtion, power with humility

 

[blargney the second]

I think it's because the arrogance sort of overwhelms any other characteristics... nobody likes people who are excessively righteous!

-blarg

ps - I often play ethically questionable characters, so a paladin cramps my style pretty badly!

 

[billd91]

It depends on the heroic style of the game. Many games, while generally heroic, also have plenty of characters running around regular law and convention, doing questionable things, while generally doing good. Paladins can be a significant challenge to overcome in games like that.
It's not that they have to be all serious and arrogant and all that. But they are expected to do things above-board. For paladins, methods matter in achieving good outcomes and, if they ignore that by letting other PCs just kind of slide in their actions, their own paladinhood is threatened.
Basically, having a paladin in the party can crimp the style some people want to play. While certainly heroic, there are limitations imposed on them and their associations that aren't there for most, if not all, other characters.

 

[Psiblade]

The majority of paladins that I have played with in home games and rpga games were roleplayed with the holier than thou attitude. Also, the paladin abilities and history lend themselves to only a couple of fighting styles. I am actually of the opinion that if you have seen one paladin, you have seen the majority of them. :\

-Psiblade

 

[Hardhead]

I love Paladins, except for the fact that they're pretty weak except for a one level dip.

 

[pawsplay]

I played in a group where the Paladin was the backbone of the group. I played a Bard who served as his squire.