Why D&D is like pr0n

[Desdichado]

double post

 

[Desdichado]

triple post

 

[Desdichado]

quadruple post. WTF, ENWorld server!

 

[anest1s]

Nope, he said to go to thread A and claim that its topic got in the way and wasted time, then go to thread B and claim that its topic was something wonderful and artistic.



In a thread about setting building, it's reasonable to assume that the people reading and contributing to the thread are interested in setting building. Coming into that thread purely to espouse an opinion that everyone there is wasting their time would not be on-topic, it would be thread-crapping.

And in any case, the reverse is just as true - drop into a thread devoted to character optimisation and claim that optimising characters is a waste of time and detracts from the pursuit of making characters with rounded and believable backstories would get a negative response, whilst joining such a thread to compliment the posters for finding new and unusual character-build synergies would receive a positive one.

I'm just saying, going into any thread and telling everyone that they're wasting their time is going to get a negative response regardless of subject matter.

"Give an entirely one sided argument that setting building just gets in the way of killing stuff and wastes time at the table."

An one sided argument, which is still an argument, and which makes sense for some kind of game.

In an other thread which was around recently, a guy was telling that he didn't like rp and etc, and that he would give it a try, and the counter suggestion was that maybe he shouldn't ruin the game of the other players, and shouldn't even play.

In other threads DMs ask what to do with hacknslash players, and they are told to kick them off the game because they are "problem players".

However when a DM says that he is railroading and that his players don't like it, he gets said that he should adapt to the group and go sandbox.


So yeah, if you post in a topic which you don't agree just to troll, of course you get dogpiled. But I don't think this was the suggestion, as usually ppl post on threads with which they disagree without trolling everyone else.

 

[R-Hero]

This is exactly the point. Without getting into a statistical evidence symposium (which Morrus here seems to be interested in), forums like this are jam-packed with threads about exactly that - "more RP, less violence, please". How many threads are there asking how to bring in "more fighting and less roleplaying"? Would you say the first instance outnumbers the second by say....9-1?

I would have to say that RPGs in general HAS to have violence to give characters something to do, gamewise.

The role playing is something that can be side-stepped if you want more violence.

You can't really sidestep the violence for more roleplay if it isn't written down in the module ahead of time.

P.S. Loved the "Frostcheeze" reference in your original post.

 

[WizarDru]

This strikes me as a false-dichotomy. Coming for a 30+ year history of RPG groups who enjoy monster-smashing and role-playing with equal zest, I'm not finding the OPs assertion to be true.

I also am having a hard time understanding the 'cup runeth over with protesting threads' idea, since when I look at the first page of General, I see stuff like this:

Players, GMs, and "My character"...
Raven Queen - tell me about her.
How "deep" into a setting will you buy?
Bookkeeping?
Players designing the world
DMs, what´s your preparation-to-enjoyment ratio?
Killing the sense of wonder
Has the Wandering Monster concept died?
Too Many Campaign ideas...
Schwarzenegger: RPG Role Mode
How ENWorld has tainted my love of D&D

I don't see really that much complaining about RP style one way or the other...and certainly not a lot of 'doth protest too much' about combat-heavy games or RP games. I see a lot of stuff that has nothing to do with the topic in either way (and thankfully the edition wars have quieted down).

I'm just having a hard time associating 'enjoys pornography' with 'gamers lie aobut their gaming style preference'. And for that matter, WHY are they supposed to by lying or otherwise ignorant of their own tastes? Someone upthread suggesting they were trying to 'look cool'? To who, other D&D nerds? To the populace in general? Specific posters on an online forum dedicated to a a self-selecting subset enthusiasts of a niche hobby that only barely has recognition beyond it's enthusiasts? I've gotta admit, that sounds awfully dicey, as premises go.

 

[Oryan77]

In an other thread which was around recently, a guy was telling that he didn't like rp and etc, and that he would give it a try, and the counter suggestion was that maybe he shouldn't ruin the game of the other players, and shouldn't even play.

Are you referring to this recent thread:
http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-discussion/294652-would-i-enjoy-d-d.html

cause if so, you totally misunderstood the OP in that thread. Never once did he say he was going to give roleplaying a try. He said he'd try playing in his friends roleplaying focused game and that he hates roleplaying. My advise to him was to not play it because he already hated the game and he hadn't even played it yet.

You make it sound like he was some innocent player just looking to give roleplaying a try and that we told him to shove off and forget about it. That is not the case at all. My apologies if you were referring to a different thread.

In other threads DMs ask what to do with hacknslash players, and they are told to kick them off the game because they are "problem players".

I can think of another thread that you may be referring to, but we get these kind of threads often so I won't bother digging it up. But again, why are you trying to make it seem like the posters on ENworld are sitting here being unfairly critical to other posters about their gaming? I'm not saying people don't, but in your examples, it really looks like you are wrongly bashing us.

I have not recently seen anyone call a hack-n-slasher a "problem player". But please, if there is a thread like that, can you give me the link to it? I'm in the mood to read some drama.

I participated in a thread where a DM was asking for help dealing with his powergaming players. Is that what you're talking about? If so, nobody called them problem players for being into hack-n-slash. People called them problem players for being powergaming problem players. If a player is causing problems to the DM to the point where they whine when they don't get their powergaming ways, then yeah, he's a problem player. But in no way is a player who likes to hack-n-slash a problem player, and I haven't seen anyone on the forums call someone like that a problem player. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

I hope you're not trying to find insult where there is none.

 

[anest1s]

...

I am sorry, in fact I was insulting, and you are right.


I didn't want to prove that "all you ppl on ENWorld are evil", but that I feel that the majority (or a shouting minority) is considering some things taboo, maybe without even realizing it.
Then again it may just be my idea, and I am not willing to prove it isn't anymore.

 

[demetri0us]

I've heard gamers claim all kinds of things, then you game with them and it's the exact opposite.

Ditto. Totally.

I've played and run 100's of games from my FLGS, to my parents basement to Gencon and I never see roleplaying of the caliber people talk about online.

I once went to a game where the GM's out of town buddy showed up to play. After discovering what my character was, he proclaimed "I don't find cheesy characters like that very interesting because I'm a roleplayer."

His version of roleplaying? An uselessly weak halfling fighter that undermined every party decision. His "roleplaying" was to be contrary in every possible way.

News flash. Roleplaying has nothing to do with what is on the paper. Pun-pun can be roleplayed just as effectively as a peasant with one arm and a drinking problem.

I actually believe most folks who think they prefer a rules light game are actually just terrible at rules theory, rules retention, character optimization, strategy and tactics. The way many of these folks seem to cope with this is to tell everybody how they play isn't in the spirit of the game. They tell us that roleplaying is the correct way to play the game.

Well, at least that's been my milages.

 

[Oryan77]

Anyway, your are brave enough to admit your own mistake. That's cool to some extent.

He also PMed me to apologize and admit he was referring to my posts in 2 other threads. He's got class.