D&D General Why Do People Hate Gnomes?

[Micah Sweet]

dwarf fans would hate it as being anything like an elf is a sin or some other convoluted thing.

Never trust an elf!

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Rename Rock Gnomes to Forest Dwarf, Forest Gnome to Fey Dwarf. Svirfneblin can be Deep Dwarf.

Give dwarves the same countless brands like elves do!

You're kidding, right?

We all know that at some point, dwarves will just be subsumed into the Greater Lamer Elf Hegemony.

"What are you playing?"

"Oh, I'm a Sun Kil Moon Elf! You?"

"I'm a Dwarf Elf. You know, a Dwelf. Cool, huh? Ain't no beard like an Elvish Beard!"

 

[Mind of tempest]

You're kidding, right?

We all know that at some point, dwarves will just be subsumed into the Greater Lamer Elf Hegemony.

"What are you playing?"

"Oh, I'm a Sun Kil Moon Elf! You?"

"I'm a Dwarf Elf. You know, a Dwelf. Cool, huh? Ain't no beard like an Elvish Beard!"

this is utterly horrific.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

this is utterly horrific.

I have seen the cold horror of the Elvish future.

Remember- you can't spell E-V-I-L with ELVISH.

 

[AdmundfortGeographer]

dwarf fans would hate it as being anything like an elf is a sin or some other convoluted thing.

Exactly fuel for the trad dwarfs to have a grudge against them and in dwarf language “gnome” is an insult for those other types.

 

[CleverNickName]

I have seen the cold horror of the Elvish future.

Remember- you can't spell E-V-I-L with ELVISH.

As I wrote in another thread: there are no other races, there is only Elf.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

As I wrote in another thread: there are no other races, there is only Elf.

Put more simply, and to answer the OP's question ...

No one hates gnomes. Instead, all supposed gnome antipathy is actually the work of BigElf(tm).

That's right. while agent provocateurs are milling about planting false and defamatory stories about supposed "Gnome Hatred," while humming Nickelback, no one is paying attention to the creeping horror that is Elvish colonization.

Even this move to "lineages?" That's just so that the ELVES can take it all without people noticing. "Oh, I'm not an Elf on the Shelf. I just have ELEVATED ELVISH LINEAGE."

Let me ask you- has an elf ever made it as a wise man? Has an elf ever cut it as a poor man stealing?

I THINK NOT!

We need to remind ourselves, every day, of what elves really are.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Welcome to the catch-22 that dragonborn fans have been forced to endure for 15 years now. Our preferences don't have enough traction or historical representation to deserve inclusion, so they never get a chance to develop a foothold, meaning they can't get any traction or historical representation.

The key difference, at least for me, is that gnomes DO have traction within the D&D space. That traction just isn't very interesting for most people, for several reasons. Whose fault that is, I've no idea (well, mostly I think it's the fault of Dragonlance and World of Warcraft, but that's a separate topic.) But the fact of the matter is, even though there are other interpretations of gnomes, the only one that's made any headway in the D&D-and-its-children space is "eccentric expert and usually comic relief/hyper-cutesy twee." That's why they're disliked so much; people who would want to do something serious with them are just usually choosing to play something else.

And I get it. I get that that sucks if you're a gnome fan, for exactly the reason I gave at the start. I've been there, with people (even theoretically friendly/positive ones) straight-up telling me I should be glad that dragonborn got included in the PHB at all.

But the thread was asking why this response occurs. I gave what I consider to be the full and complete answer: they're short (short races will always be less popular than human-height or taller races, except for their potential as twee or comic-relief options), they're often portrayed even by players who love them as completely non-serious, usually comic relief or zAnY wAcKy HiJiNkS types; their major, public-facing appearances in well-known fiction almost exclusively support the latter, with World of Warcraft being the prime offender (since it's much bigger than D&D has ever been, having had easily tens of millions of players over the many years it's been a thing.)

That doesn't mean you shouldn't play them. Hell, it doesn't mean you shouldn't campaign for gnomes to get a different take, something more interesting than the crappy typecasting they've gotten. You should totally do both of those things. But those three reasons are why most players won't play them or even outright dislike them, and it's very hard for individual folks (like you and me) to change any of those things.

I think you may be misinterpreting my response, to a small degree. That doesn't mean I don't get what you are saying, but you seem to misunderstanding why I was responding as I did.

I agree with you, Gnomes do have traction. That's why I responded as I did to the idea that the main interpretation of gnomes is Garden Gnomes. That may be true for people not in the western fantasy space, but for people in that space and reading some of the newer fantasy works, Gnomes have a different view. Saying (to my mind) that those views are in the minority, is fine. But saying that they are somehow canceled by the Garden Gnome would be like saying that Elves are canceled by Santa. Because unless you are in the fantasy space, your view on elves are either the North Pole or Keebler.

It almost comes across as "I've never heard of it, so it doesn't matter" which... well, go to a Biker bar and start asking people what they think of Driz'zt Do'Urden and you are going to get the same resonse (most likely and stereotypically) so it is frustrating to see that continue here.

And... I would also say that, I completely understand if people hate Gnomes or dislike gnomes because they've only seen them as Tinker Gnomes fro, Dragonlance. I don't particularly care for that either, and gnomes are short and cute, and they are often comic relief. But... Thor from Marvel is often comic relief. Ant-Man is often comic relief. Does that mean they have zero serious stories? No, absolutely not. "Eccentric and does science" can be comic relief. It can be serious. But a lot of people think that is all they CAN be, and maybe I can't change people's minds, but if you go looking for it, you find that gnomes ARE more than that.

For example, one of the most popular gnome characters in DnD right now is likely Scanlan Shorthalt. He is the comic relief, he is a completely ridiculous person. A lot of people would also tell you that he had the most emotionally resonant moment in the entire series. Gnomes can be more than the stereotype. Just like every other race. And if you don't like them because of the stereotype, that's fine. I can accept that, but it should be noted that they don't have to follow that stereotype.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Who?

I literally provided the names, series, author and publication dates. I'm pretty sure I don't need to read it for you as well.

"But I've never heard of them"

So? They exist whether or not you've ever heard of them or not.

 

[Vaalingrade]

They exist whether or not you've ever heard of them or not.

There is a deep philosophical discussion we could have on this. It's like the one about the tree falling in a forest and there's no one around.