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D&D General why do we have halflings and gnomes?

they feel like something that crawled out one of those works the preach if only we just wanted the joys of home, family and good food nothing bad would ever happen which just does not add up it breaks immersion in-game.
they feel like they are out of a fairy tale but without the magic or fun.
You are not entirely wrong, since they come from the Lord of the Rings, a book which preaches that only ordinary folk who just want the joys of home, family and good food (and drink) have the moral fortitude to overcome evil without being corrupted by it.

Personally, I can get behind that sentiment, but I guess if you prefer a "might makes right" philosophy you aint going to like halflings, and no amount of arguments are going to change that.
 

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Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
it is not the adventuring it is also the profound lack of any goals or how they would survive in a world full of deadly monsters beyond the words they get lucky.

they feel like something that crawled out one of those works the preach if only we just wanted the joys of home, family and good food nothing bad would ever happen which just does not add up it breaks immersion in-game.
they feel like they are out of a fairy tale but without the magic or fun.
If you've spent thousands of years surviving due to supernatural luck, why would you bother to make plans for goals for survival?
 

Practically every nonD&D western fantasy video game?

Warcraft, Warhammer, Might and Magic Dragon Age, etc.

Many games skip halflings but keep human, elf, and dwarf. The few that keep halfling are official D&D games who are forced to keep halflings or games that make halflings weak or joke characters that don't get pushed to the foreground.
I'm pretty sure that the Might and Magic series has halflings, and know for a fact that Warhammer does.
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
feel like a pretty large difference of opinion here is that you seem to feel the onus is on the designers to provide this rationale in the core book, whereas most other posters in this thread feel the responsibility for such an explanation falls upon the GM if such an explanation is required or even necessary in their game.

No. I am saying the iconic races should be treated the same.

Display warriors and wizards of all races or none at all.

Racial equality.


The other difference is that you seem to feel such a simulative explanation is necessary for the gameplay, which again is not an opinion that seems to be shared within this thread

Not really.

I just want it treated equally.
If one iconic race has a warrior trope then they are should.
 

Scribe

Legend
No. I am saying the iconic races should be treated the same.

Display warriors and wizards of all races or none at all.

Racial equality.

Why? Why make all races the same? Why allow for racial attributes that are tied to tropes to be shifted around on a whim and erase more and more of what makes the races different anyway?

Why cant Halflings function as small communities that live, grow, pay taxes, and are afforded the protections of the land as part of a community within a kingdom and not driving it? How is THAT not an identity that is distinct when applied to an entire race?

Why cant Halflings be iconic in NOT being a race of Warriors and Wizards, when nearly every other race has them?
 


Charlaquin

Goblin Queen (She/Her/Hers)
No. I am saying the iconic races should be treated the same.

Display warriors and wizards of all races or none at all.

Racial equality.




Not really.

I just want it treated equally.
If one iconic race has a warrior trope then they are should.
That’s just absurd. They’re different races, why wouldn’t they be treated differently? The diversity among D&D races is a strength.
 

Puddles

Adventurer
Just here to say I adore gnomes and loathe halfings haha. There have never been any halflings in my campaigns and there never will be unless I have a player that chooses to be one, and then they can come up with a halfing populace that they hail from. (I don't ban any fantasy races in my campaigns).

On the other hand, I love gnomes and include them as a focal point in all my settings. I just find they work so well alongside Dwarves. While Dwarves are stern, grudge-bearers who grumble and complain and are hardy and tough, gnomes are whimsical and eccentric and just pure fun to interact with. I always have a gnomish quarter in every Dwarven settlement and will usually make an NPC jeweler to be a character the PCs can sell treasure to, and one that has a well stocked library and knows about the ancient secrets of the world.

I also love gnomes as a way of adding steampunk elements to a world, and usually have them be pioneers of invention and alchemy. One quirk I like to give my gnomes is they are obsessed with patents on technology, and will even cover inventions in useless trinkets and gizmos that are designed to confuse other gnomes attempting the steal the inner workings of a machine.
 

doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
it is not the adventuring it is also the profound lack of any goals or how they would survive in a world full of deadly monsters beyond the words they get lucky.

they feel like something that crawled out one of those works the preach if only we just wanted the joys of home, family and good food nothing bad would ever happen which just does not add up it breaks immersion in-game.
they feel like they are out of a fairy tale but without the magic or fun.
All I really want to say to this is...okay. To you they feel that way. I strongly doubt the percentage of dnd players who feel the same is even double digits.
No. I am saying the iconic races should be treated the same.

Display warriors and wizards of all races or none at all.

Racial equality.
I barely have words for how much I absolutely despise this notion. What a direct and expedient way to make halflings a complete waste of page space.
If you want to add a culture of halflings to Rashemen that ride goats into battle, wear wood masks with carefully cultivated moss and train ravens to scout for them, and train from childhood to hunt and kill necromancers and their undead servants, go for it! I do stuff like that all the time.

However, the iconic halfling culture doesn't have standout warrior traditions, or magical traditions, they just have folks. Their warriors are bounders whose training and gear is very practical and who are just John the Bounder. Their wizards are hedge wizard nerds whose magic is probably most practical with some broad utility up their sleeve, and most magic they'd use to defend their town is magic that was invented for something other than battle, or at least can be used outside of combat.

Their adventurers are people who come from a small town that most folk outside of it don't even know is there, or who grew up in a settlement of another race, where they were the Small Folk amongst bigger, louder, less lucky, less likeable, folk.

That's who halflings are. That is a good niche. If you don't like it, add to your game worlds on your own, or leave them out.
Not really.

I just want it treated equally.
If one iconic race has a warrior trope then they are should.
That would actively make the game less good. No. Gods no.
 

doctorbadwolf

Heretic of The Seventh Circle
Gods I just can't even fathom why on Earth anyone would ever want a game to "show warriors and wizards of all races or none"....What an awful idea.

DnD's races already overlap quite a lot, leading to a lot of people to want to erase many of them from either their own campaign or the game in general, and you want them to be presented in a more similar manner!? Why?
 

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