D&D General Why Exploration Is the Worst Pillar

[MichaelSomething]

Perhaps I can offer a new perspective? Instead of arguing over resource attrition, we could take time to learn from a master of exploration??

 

[Aldarc]

There is a simple explanation for why players don’t use unseen servant as some sort of minesweeping service. Though I agree with you that it doesn’t work in most cases.

The simple answer is that it would be extremely dull for the other PCs to sit and wait. If I’m in the party and the wizard player says they want to take 30 minutes to summon and send their unseen servant to laboriously search a section of 20ft hallway. After the second or third time I am almost certainly going to say screw that I’ll just walk down the corridor. The risk of getting dumped in a pit of acid is better than all this waiting around.

I think that this is where the 10 ft. pole and "send in the hirelings" tactics came about in the earlier iterations of the game.

 

[TheSword]

I think that this is where the 10 ft. pole and "send in the hirelings" tactics came about in the earlier iterations of the game.

We used a pig back when we were 14. Smack on the rump and sent it squealing down the corridor to see which monsters and traps were revealed.

When we grew we realized that this broke the social contract so we stopped doing it.

 

[TheSword]

So if I want to lose weight with my diet, then I should cut out the exploration carbs?

Well all that trekking will help you lose weight so that might be counterproductive. If weight loss is your aim, I’d certainly stop sending your unseen servant to do your chores for you.

 

[Yora]

I think that this is where the 10 ft. pole and "send in the hirelings" tactics came about in the earlier iterations of the game.

Soon followed by "hirelings will not go into dungeons".

 

[Hussar]

If combat is the meat, and roleplay is the butter, then exploration is the bread. It is far more substantial than mere connective tissue. It supports and binds the combat and roleplay encounters making them more flavorful as a result. Though it can also be enjoyed on its own or with a smattering of roleplay or a dash of combat.

My group had a thoroughly enjoyable session in the opening manor of Saltmarsh exploring a supposedly haunted house. We fought a couple of spider swarms and a weasel, but that was it. That majority of the sessions was spent exploring. It was a lot of fun.

The exploration pillar works just fine, but it does require some thought, preparation and a DM capable of bringing the exploration to life. For me it’s by far the most wonderful pillar and far more exciting than combat or roleplay!

That's a great example. Now, you're talking about the first two floors right? Not the basement which is mostly combat, I'm assuming.

Now, searching the house, if you play the module as written is pretty much zero stakes. There might be a trap here or there? It's been a while since I ran this, so, I'm a bit fuzzy. But, as I recall, it's about 15 empty rooms, 3 rooms with something in it, and that's about it. So, the exploration part is largely searching around empty rooms, where there is no threat (but the players can't know that) and no stakes (again, totally invisible to the players) and faffing about doing an awful lot of nothing.

Hey, if that's what you guys enjoy, knock yourselves out. My group, when I ran this? They didn't even bother with the second floor after realizing that there was pretty much nothing on the first floor and found the way down. That poor NPC that's on the second floor? He died of starvation. Never even got a chance to make an appearance.

 

[Asisreo]

But there is "auto-winning" against the environmental challenges that try to hamper exploration. Yes you're still discovering something new, but is the process of doing so slow and challenging or is it fast, safe and easy. That's the difference auto-win makes.

Its true in the sense that certain challenges during exploration can be overcome quickly but the cost of doing so is unpredictable on the player's end.

In combat, if I make an attack roll I usually know all of the risks. Sometimes a negative effect may catch a player by surprise like with a Fire Elemental or Rust Monster's feature, but I know hit = damage = guaranteed positive. The same is true for the buffs and debuffs. So long as they're active, you're sure of how helpful they are.

With exploration, nothing is guaranteed. That door might help, harm, or do nothing to you and bypassing it likely means you miss something. The same for the room beyond.

Here's a point of interest: place those famous 30' chasms in your game and, at the very bottom, put some cool magic items from lost adventurers. Make sure the bottom is out of view from the edge. Watch as the wizards "win" this challenge by shooting their own foot and missing out on something that could have helped the group.

So I wouldn't call these bypasses "winning." Its a different type of engagement but you still have to deal with the consequences of not knowing no matter if your fingers are sparkly or not.

 

[iserith]

There is a simple explanation for why players don’t use unseen servant as some sort of minesweeping service. Though I agree with you that it doesn’t work in most cases.

The simple answer is that it would be extremely dull for the other PCs to sit and wait. If I’m in the party and the wizard player says they want to take 30 minutes to summon and send their unseen servant to laboriously search a section of 20ft hallway. After the second or third time I am almost certainly going to say screw that I’ll just walk down the corridor. The risk of getting dumped in a pit of acid is better than all this waiting around.

I think this could be managed fine and is not all that dissimilar from a familiar scouting ahead. It really just needs a thorough action declaration by the player and the DM to get to the next important decision (or crisis) point quickly. But of course, could, and would are different things altogether. I've certainly seen the familiar issue handled poorly.

 

[Swarmkeeper]

I see where you're going here, but this has a strange presupposition -- that only one or two characters are actually engaged in exploration -- the others are doing things that aren't advancing the exploration, like keeping watch, or fighting off the monster, or talking the NPC down, or whatever, while just a few deal with exploration. I find this a rather typical approach to 5e exploration -- only one or a few PCs really matter at a time.

Keeping watch/staying alert is not an important party role in exploration? What is it, then, in your games?

There's almost no way to build exploration that engages everyone at the same time and still balances a fail condition so that the play can move forward. I mean, I can think of a few things that might, like group moves, but these are very rare in published materials and I have no idea how often they're used in wider play. I use them, fairly often, but then I've made an effort to build challenges that require the entire party tries to do a thing together, so it fits. I mean, who has the entire party search for traps and calls for a group move to resolve it? I've done this, in the wilderness but not in a dungeon, with a "the trap is where it is when it's invoked" kind of trap, so the group move worked well. If you have a detailed map, or a dungeon, where it's clear PC1 will step where the trap is, the group move doesn't make sense, but this then reinforces my point about only one or a few PCs are ever really involved in most 5e exploration challenges.

We don’t seem to have this issue with exploration at our table. After describing the current scene, I ask each player what their PC is doing and trying to accomplish and then I resolve what happens accordingly after everyone has had a say. Sometimes the challenge is obvious (e.g. sneak across the courtyard) and the party members all takes the same course of action, possibly requiring a group check. More often the challenge is less so (e.g. searching a dungeon chamber) and the players declare that their PCs are doing separate activities each of which are adjudicated as necessary - again, after everyone has had a chance to say what their PC is doing and trying to accomplish. If I am paying attention to the spotlight (and the players are, too), every player has a say in what their PC is doing. So, while some exploration activities may be more exciting or more fruitful than others for any given exploration scene, I don’t find exploration involves “only one or a few PCs”. Clearly, YMMV.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Tell you what: Why don't you tell me what kinds of traps can't be triggered by an unseen servant? Because if your answer is effectively "none," then we're just not going to agree on this point because we're not playing the same game.

Anything that requires more than 60 lbs of pressure to activate and possibly magical traps depending on how they are worded.

Do I pass the test? Can we have a conversation now?

You are making assumptions as to the example I used. I never suggested other parts of the dungeon couldn't be explored after the trap went off. Just that that passage was blocked. Such is the problem with examples in forum discussions - people see the things that support their point and ignore the stuff that doesn't.

But otherwise, yes, the unseen servant is destroyed, which protects the rogue. Great! Except now the noise has drawn a wandering monster to the area and the exploration challenge of making progress down that hallway to see what's there still isn't over. All that has been accomplished is making it potentially harder to resolve and it'll be another 10 minutes to make a new unseen servant. Hardly a victory.

So, how is this not a victory?

Other parts of the dungeon are still open, so we can go deal with them. Some random monster showed up and started the combat pillar, that has nothing to do with exploration at all. And this trap that could have killed the rogue didn't.

What's down the hall? Well, a giant stone pillar we can't get past. If there isn't a way somewhere else to reset it, then this passage is done and there is no point in worrying about it. We either try and force our way through (which we would have had to do either way if the rogue failed to spot this trap) or we ignore it and move on. And, no one in the party died.

It depends on how you frame the dramatic question: "Can I resolve this exploration challenge without drawing unwanted attention, taking too much damage, or spending a lot of resources?" for example. Not "Can I resolve the exploration challenge at any cost?" In the case of the unseen servant and the falling block trap, the answer to the first question is "No."

In any event, the game shifts between challenges in various pillars regularly, depending on what's going on. I'm not sure what you're driving at by implying this is an issue of some kind.

Unwanted attention from what? Monsters we are likely going to have to kill anyways? There are certainly going to be fights in the dungeon no matter what we do, unless these monsters apparate out of thin air, then loudly fighting in one room is going to draw them anyways.

Spending resources? Other than time rituals cost no resources. None. Zero. Once you have them, they are unlimited and free forever.

Taking Too Much Damage? How much is too much? That is a question that really depends on your resources and the party. I once had a conversation that if you are splitting gold evenly that by the time a heavily armored character is wearing full plate (1500 gold) that a character who doesn't use a lot of equipment like the monk could have purchased 30 healing potions. At 2d4+2, that is an average of 210 extra health for the party. Before short resting to use HD. Before spells that heal.

And if we do take too much damage then we retreat, find a place to long rest, then go again another time. Unless we are on a time limit or there are infinite monsters, eventually the players can stop taking damage from fights and focus on the exploration. In which case, they have the tools to succeed. Because, notice, the biggest challenge in exploration... is monsters that you have to fight in the combat pillar....Weird, right?