D&D 4E Why I like the 4ed Forgotten Realms (and 4ed in general, for that matter)

[The Little Raven]

My black heart is saddened by rumors that Thay will be one of them (after it gets überthrashed by the Spellplague).

Thay is still Thay. It's just a plateau higher in the air than it was previously, which has changed it's relationship with outlying lands. Szass Tam is still there and still in charge, and the Red Wizards are still a threat.

 

[The Ubbergeek]

My black heart is saddened by rumors that Thay will be one of them (after it gets überthrashed by the Spellplague).

-Samir Asad

On the serious troubles in Thay, the first part...

Really, Thay was anyway condemned to troubles had ANY changes to magic would have happened. Any. The whole country is a magocracy, remember - change a bit how arcane magic, and the whole edifice may shake.


And note, the whole country is potentialy very unstable... first, there is a rothé dung high numbers of slaves, and if our history shown us well,this is potential troubles - janissaires and mamelukis, anyone?

Also, there is not much of a central authority - that lich sulkir of Necromancy is close, but not quite.... It's a serie of semi-independant lords of magic and governors, always intriguing and schieming. And so, Thay is doomed one day to break into civil, factions war...

Really, this is one of the most realist bits of the changes. Thay was to be screwed in such an event. As for being submirsed... Maybe. But politicaly at least perhaps, neghboors may have their revenge and ironicaly perhaps gobble some pieces of Thay.

Thay would and will not escape this century healthy. At least not at start.

 

[Primal]

Or it could be that alot of them feared anything happening to the Weave, ie: them losing their powers.

So they concentrated on making sure to maintain the Weave.

Actually, IIRC Ed Greenwood has said on Candlekeep.com that the Divine Essence bestowed by Mystra in her Chosen would not "disappear" with her death or even when the Weave collapses. They could not access any of their Weave-based abilities, but the Divine Essence would enable them to work around the problem somewhat. Anyway, that's how I remember it.

 

[wingsandsword]

It did mean that evil mystic theurges couldn't worship the goddess of magic (according to the RAW).

Except that Mystra was a special exception to that rule and could be treated as NG or LN for purposes of allowed cleric alignment: Clerics who were in the clergy of the old LN Mystra didn't have to change alignment when she was reborn as an NG deity.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Actually, IIRC Ed Greenwood has said on Candlekeep.com that the Divine Essence bestowed by Mystra in her Chosen would not "disappear" with her death or even when the Weave collapses. They could not access any of their Weave-based abilities, but the Divine Essence would enable them to work around the problem somewhat. Anyway, that's how I remember it.

Ed Greenwood has a say in FR 4e but not the final say. I think WotC deliberately killed her in part to weaken the Chosen. Say something about "sympathetic feedback" or "retcon" and it's all good

 

[Ipissimus]

I've never really understood the reticence that people have over the many high-level characters in FR. It's not like, in all the world, every adventurer is going to bump into Elminster or Drizzt at some point any more than every character will bump into Mordenkainen or one of the Circle of Eight in Greyhawk. So why does FR hold that stigma where other settings don't?

That being said, the 100 year time difference is going to make things interesting for the likes of Drizzt. Makes me wonder what happened with Catte Brie, Wulfgar and Bruenor. And what level Drizzt will be up to by then. Aslo, what happens to Spellfire now that magic's all topsy turvy... or was Spellfire the prelude to Warlocks?

I'm gonna have to cross my fingers and hope that Elistraee and her woshippers are still around somehow. Though, some form of merger with Selune a-la Sharess and Bast could be cool.

The Spellplague actually interests me more than anything else. One thing I've always liked about FR, Wild and Dead magic zones, and now Spellplague zones. As far as I'm concerned, anything that allows you to mess with players is a good thing. And, in addition, spellplague zones could give characters interesting twists in background and mechanics.

More than anything else, though, I'm looking forward to the new rules on Fey'ri. I've always wanted to play a Fey'ri character, but races with LA always left a bad taste in my mouth. Now, I might be able to play a Fey'ri Warlock without the hassle.

 

[Keefe the Thief]

If you´ve DMed the Realms for a long time without seeing a problem with things like lvl 18 fighter barkeeps and loads of epic level "ally" type NPCs mentioned in books and novels, you didn´t have a problem. It´s been mostly new DMs and players who came into FR for the first time and went "wtf? why doesn´t El out-epic the problem?"

Remember, today a lot of people are happy if they find the time to play for a couple of levels. If you begin at level 4 and KNOW your adventuring career will perhaps last to level 11 or so before the group falls apart or begins a new Burning Wheel campaign, it´s okay to be slightly miffed at all the Chosen standing around doing nothing while you fight the drow invasion yourself. Especially if you are SURE that you´ll never ever out-level them.

 

[Ipissimus]

If you´ve DMed the Realms for a long time without seeing a problem with things like lvl 18 fighter barkeeps and loads of epic level "ally" type NPCs mentioned in books and novels, you didn´t have a problem, etc.

Ugh, to make it clear, I'm not trying to sleight or ignore the feelings of those who do have this problem. It just mystifies me.

I can understand new DMs not using high level characters correctly and ticking off his players, but that's the DM's problem not a setting problem. Your second point I simply don't understand at all. Why would anyone get miffed at a fictional plot device? Is it level envy? Do people somehow feel that these fictional characters are somehow more important than their PCs? Are unskilled DMs using them badly? And why does FR bare the brunt of this animosity when other settings are just as guilty?

 

[Bluenose]

Ugh, to make it clear, I'm not trying to sleight or ignore the feelings of those who do have this problem. It just mystifies me.

I can understand new DMs not using high level characters correctly and ticking off his players, but that's the DM's problem not a setting problem. Your second point I simply don't understand at all. Why would anyone get miffed at a fictional plot device? Is it level envy? Do people somehow feel that these fictional characters are somehow more important than their PCs? Are unskilled DMs using them badly? And why does FR bare the brunt of this animosity when other settings are just as guilty?

Other settings aren't as guilty. FR has more than 200 wizards capable of casting Wish, and it's highest level characters are higher level than those in most other settings. You then add in the "Chosen of Mystra" aspect, and it's hardly a surprise that people regard the Chosen as Mary-Sues and by extension tar many of the other high-level NPCs with the same brush.

Also, the contradictory opinions that people have about them don't suggest that even the people who really like them agree on how they should be used best. It shouldn't be possible to totally ignore such a large number of high-level characters, and if it is possible to ignore them then I can't see how they can be claimed to be so critical to the setting that removing them destroys everything people like about FR.

 

[The Ubbergeek]

200? Are you not hyperboling? :\