Why I only buy open content

philreed said:
Now this means, to me, that if I'm reading the book and it sparks an idea I can create a product based on that idea. It doesn't mean to me that I should just scan in the text and post it online for free.

It means that you "can" use the exact wording of the text in your own work. Maybe you don't believe that you, or anyone, "should", but that's an ethical issue, not a legal one, and beyond your control.

I dunno. I think if the OGL was set up to be as restrictive and closed off as some publishers seem to want, nearly all of the pdf publishers and a good number of the print publishers wouldn't exist. OGC would be sealed off for the sole use of a small pool of either WotC-cronies or buy-in publishers. My sympathy is extremely limited, in that case. Does the OGL give you everything you want? Clearly not. Does it give the "OGC must be free" crowd everything they want? Clearly not. And the fact that both crowds are dissatisfied is to me the clearest sign that the OGL is working correctly.

The OGL is, absolutely, the best thing to happen to this hobby since the creation of D&D.

Cheers,
Nell.
 

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Yair said:
But not purchasing anything that is even partially closed, that... will leave you with just about the SRD :confused:

And most of Bastion Press's books, a goodly number of Green Ronin's material, and (rough guess) a third to a half of the pdf products out there.

But a much smaller pool, yes.

Cheers
Nell.
 

Nellisir said:
And most of Bastion Press's books, a goodly number of Green Ronin's material, and (rough guess) a third to a half of the pdf products out there.

But a much smaller pool, yes.
If you want to take it to extremes, then most of these won't qualify either as they include at least some PI (such as the company's name and so on).
But yes, you're right.
 


Personally, I think the idea of an "OGC website" is a good one. Think about it for a moment - all kinds of OGC material gathered in one place for easy reference. Say you want to make rule X - but oh look, someone's already done rule X, and better. And it's OGC! So you reprint it from the site (or just reference it - more on that in a bit) and slap it in the Section 15. Now (and I think this is Phil's concern) most consumers don't bother looking in the S15, so they won't know where those cool rules come from - they think it was the author's doing and not company Y, so they buy more of the author's books instead of buying Company Y's book, where the rule was in the first place. Some authors (and Ralts did this with the horror/insanity rules in YotZ) post in the text where they got the rules, so an interested consumer can go check out that other product as well.

And on the other side of the coin...

Free declaration of OGC is all great and wonderful, but some publishers like to know where their work is going. In some cases, they want to know that the derivative works won't cast a bad light on their products; in others, they want to know who the other party is, so they can support the other guy's products in the future (you know, the concept of "community support"?).
 



philreed said:
Exactly. And I -- stupidly -- thought that others working in the game industry felt the same way. For most people working with the OGC and OGC the concept that OGC is intended for publishers and not free online distribution isn't strange. And as long as the concept of an "all the OGC in the world for free!" website was being thrown about by people without any influence there was little chance of it happening.
Who made you in charge of who can enjoy the OGC and who can't?

The OGC was designed so that fans and people who wanted to try to create 3rd party products could. See that first part? fans People who liked the game.

Honestly, the hubris in that statement makes it sound as if you are saying if you aren't a publisher, you have no business mucking about with the OGC.

Today, though, we have a "name" author pushing for such a site.
As a non-name author, I hereby endorse the idea of such a site, and wish to subscribe to it's news letter. Simply drop Kerrick or I a line, and we will be glad to donate both published AND unpublished OGC material to such a site. Nearly a thousand spells, 100 feats, and 50 PrC's should be welcome.


How do I say this? Nicely. This is ENWorld after all.

OK, let's say I'm writing "The complete guide to donkey punching." Now, I remember there being a feat in "Blood & Farms" that resembles one I want to make. I go to the sight, use the search engine, search through 15 pages of feats, to find the one I want. YAY! There it is! A feat that gives you a +2 to knock out furless animals when wielding a 2x4! Thanks Chuck! So, I reprint it (with a byline on the feat labeling where it is from, as is my style) and save myself -20 minutes because I stopped at several webcomic sites and posted here at ENWorld twice.

Let's say I'm getting ready to run a module. Or start a a campaign setting. Yeah, we'll go with that. I start a campaign setting, but I'm a skinflint cheapskate who pinches Lincoln until he screams, so I decide that instead of buying books, I'll go to the website. Now, I'd NEVER buy a book anyway, and would probably boot up a file sharing program and steal the damn thing anyway, so I hunt through this HUGE site, that contains everything from "Lipstick Wearing Robots d20" to "The Complete Llamma Rider" to "d20 Future Robots: Whiners and Snivellers" and spend the next two months looking over feats, and wasting more ink than a scientist trying to teach a monkey to draw portriats of lab rats. Who loses out? Not me, not any other publisher. Nobody like this even buys your product anyway. He steals it.

Let's say I'm getting ready to start a campaign setting. I go to this site, and look, using the fantastic search engine, for: Feats, desert, non-human, non-stupid, non-broken, non-dark elf, non-fluff text, non-modern, non-future, non-Trued20, non-Goathead, non-blather....

WTF was I doing? Oh, yeah, searching through GIGABYTES of data looking for a free feat. Screw this, I'm going to RPGNow and buy the book or make my own. Hell with it, I'm gonna go read something awful and post about how I hate Britney Spears.


Yeah, the site is such a menace. If it ever gets going, nobody will ever buy hardback or PDF gaming books again, online dice generators will rub the color off of your dice's number, Monte Cook will come to your house and urinate in your fish tank, and ENWorld will go down.

Grow up. If nothing else, the entry: "SOURCE: Drooling SImpletons Guide to Some Lame Location by Stinky Monkey Press" will be about the best advertisement you could get.


Now, as to the other points...


Yeah, you don't have to ask. It's fine if you don't. You'll be considered rude and a jerk, but if you can live with that, that's fine. Like it was thrown around several years ago: "Nothing is stopping someone from taking a bunch of OGC, adding in some flavor text and pictures of a duck waddling across the road, and making a new book out of it, and selling it on RPGNow for $5 a copy." Of course, nothing is stopping me from standing by the road and punching hobo's in face.

You don't ask, you reprint someone else's stuff, you don't put it in the Section 15, and you'll pretty much get slammed everywhere. You'll be known as a cheat, a thief, and at the very least, as sneak.

Oh, and if asking someone if you can use thier OGC material in a homebrew is assinine.

Asking if you can publish it shouldn't harm your creative juices. If it does, the well may be a bit dry, and you might consider an X-Box.
 

Hal Whitewyrm said:
Somehow this thread and the one on the OGC Wiki keep getting mixed up.

DaveMage said:
I only buy Wikis with open content.
No, wait...

Wikis open buy I content free restrictions.

-THAT- thread is the one where they want to steal all your hard work and give it away.

-THIS- thread is where we won't buy your stuff if you have OGC declarations like "The zeitgeist of OGC herein and within this manuscript of gamewielding shall be inscribed to be deciphered on the Blue Area of the Moon, not including Chapter Six. And anything from the SRD is Open Content."

Toggle?
Nell.
 

You know.. even if the whole product is OGC it is really a good thing to contact the publisher anyway.

They like to hear how things will be used.
Heck some will even provide you with a text file with the materials you need in it, so you don't have to retype.
Some will give you publicity on their website.
Some may very well give you permission to directly reference the book.
And some just like to feel recognized. And have some sort of idea that their work is being used and they aren't designing in a vacuum.
 

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