Why I Think Rolling For Hit Points is a Bad Thing

[Falling Icicle]

It all depends on what you want. Do you emphasize strictly balanced development or do you favor seeing unexpected developments emerge over the life of the character. The latter really helps breathe life into the game for me. Too much planned structure feels way too sterile and artificial. I want a bit of chaos in the mix.

I want a bit of chaos in the mix too, but I want it to be in the form of the players' choices, not random hit points or trap choices that make one character objectively better than another for no good reason.

 

[variant]

If you want to increase the hit point average, just reroll any hit die that rolls your Constitution modifier or lower. Another option is increase the minimum hit points to x2 your Constitution modifier.

 

[Walking Dad]

...

If someone wanted to get 5 hit points instead of 1d8, I'd give it to him and to hell with the extra hit point, but I think that high adventure isn't very exciting unless you're a gambler at heart.

I think chess is a great exciting game, with mind and tactics used to win against your enemy.
Roulette is a game of chance I don't enjoy. You can have a great tactic and loose to chance more often than not.

If you want to increase the hit point average, just reroll any hit die that rolls your Constitution modifier or lower. Another option is increase the minimum hit points to x2 your Constitution modifier.

I don't want higher average. I would be fine with wizards gaining 1, rogues 2, clerics 4 and fighters 4 HP a day, each less than a usual roll.

I ask again, with HP such an important resource, why is it much more variable for a fighter than for a wizard?

 

[pemerton]

It's called realism. Some people are simply tougher and more resilient than others.

Isn't that what level, and perhaps the CON stat, are about?

If we're randomising the CON stat, why do we also need to randomise hp (which is in any event not toughness but luck and divine favour, at least to a signficant extent)?

The life expectancy of a male residing in the US is 75.6.

The life expectancy of a 50 year old male residing in the US is substantially higher, because he has failed to die before attaining the age of 50.

The average hit points of a level 10 D&D character might be X.

But the average hit points of a level 10 D&D character who rolled a 1 for hit points at level 2 is Y, where Y is less than X by the difference between 1 and the mid point of his hit die.

Dice have no memory. If you roll badly early, you shift your expected long term value to the left.

I thought you were going to make a different point, that the average hp of 10th level fighters is probably considerably higher than 55 (= 10 * 5.5), because more of those who rolled poorly at low levels died before making it to 10th.

Which to my mind just tends to reinforce the potential suckiness of hp rolls.

if you reroll all of your HD each level, the curve gets even tighter. Ie, whenever you gain a level, gain a new HD. Now roll all of your HD and add your constitution score. You may choose to keep your old HP, or use this new roll.

I believe that this is how OD&D did it (except CON factored in slightly differently).

for the playtest PCs it seems like the designers gave a fixed initial value of HPs and then give an additional value (average hit die value).

The playtest PCs have hp equal to CON score plus level * half the hit die size.

It's very close to 4e, except for 4e PCs the multiplier is not "level" but rather "level +1.5".

 

[variant]

I don't want higher average. I would be fine with wizards gaining 1, rogues 2, clerics 4 and fighters 4 HP a day, each less than a usual roll.

I ask again, with HP such an important resource, why is it much more variable for a fighter than for a wizard?

The fighter has the advantage of having the ability to have more than a wizard.

 

[imurphy943]

I think chess is a great exciting game, with mind and tactics used to win against your enemy.

I like the kind of tactics that D&D, as a game of infinite possibility, brings to the table, like diplomacy, surprise attacks, poison, explosives, traps, etc.

Roulette is a game of chance I don't enjoy. You can have a great tactic and loose to chance more often than not.

If you start a game of chess with three pawns missing, it doesn't cause tactics to fail unless you insist on acting exactly the same as you would with all your pawns.
This argument would be more relevant if you were arguing against random damage, attack rolls, saving throws, or critical hits.

 

[Savage Wombat]

I suspect that, just as the rules will tell you to roll stats and then give you the option of using the array (and everyone will), the rules will tell you to roll HP and then give you the option of taking a fixed value (and everyone will).

 

[Steely_Dan]

I suspect that, just as the rules will tell you to roll stats and then give you the option of using the array (and everyone will), the rules will tell you to roll HP and then give you the option of taking a fixed value (and everyone will).

Not my buddy the psion/wizard player, he's got some sick power to never seem to roll under a 3 on a d4 for HP (does not like ability score arrays either).

 

[keterys]

I suspect most people won't roll... so long as it feels like rolling isn't just _better_. Ie, if the stat array provides worse stats than rolling, and the hp "average" is below average as well, they'll just roll. Which is probably the case, at first glance. The way they're having Con interact with hit points actually makes taking average even less likely.

This thread is making me wonder how many people would like to roll randomly for other character creation features, though.

Like, you go to take the Commoner background and it gives you 3 skills on average, but you can roll 3d6 and divide by 3 for # of skills (rounding down as usual).

Or instead of giving a damage bonus at set levels, fighters roll a d20 every level and get +1 damage whenever they roll an 11 or higher.

 

[Janaxstrus]

I suspect that, just as the rules will tell you to roll stats and then give you the option of using the array (and everyone will), the rules will tell you to roll HP and then give you the option of taking a fixed value (and everyone will).

We always roll for stats and HPs. Point buy and "everyone get's max hitpoints" seems boring and cookie cutter, to me personally.

If they want to have those as options, I have no problem with it. I'd rather they stick with D&D tradition for the default. Other people's opinion may vary.