OGL Why I'm not boycotting the movie, video games, comic books or novels over the OGL scandal, just D&DB & hardcovers.

1. WotC has already lost, they've walked back almost everything, and a lot of what's left that folks hate will be dust from the D&D Beyond boycott and hardcover boycott. The last, biggest part the OGL 1.0a revocation is already on shaky ground because of internal opposition, bad PR, and the current TTRPG boycott, and WotC has no legal case to revoke the OGL not even counting the perpetual vs irrevokible issue, they will lose any court case Paizo and others bring against them, which will come, and in the extremely unlikely scenario that WotC wins, Paizo will likely get an injunction against revoking OGL 1.0a until the case is resolved, which could take years to resolve, destroying WotC schedule and making One D&D ompossible to release next year. This is a no win scenerio for them and the smallest loses are letting go of the new OGL altogether.

2. I don't blame WotC for this, I blame CEO Chris Cocks, WotC President Cynthia Williams, and D&D Vice President Rawson, those are my targets, not WotC. I've learned its more effective to go after corporate leadership then a corporation.

3. Most of the damage this will do has already been done, most 3pp aren't coming back for the foreseeable future.

4. The Forgotten Realms has been severly under supportered in 5e, especially mid to late 5e, FR needs this movie and it's novels. Frankly FR setting is more important to me then D&D, so that is my priorities. Not that things will get worse for D&D see point 1.

I will continue to support the D&D Beyond and TTRPG hardcover boycott until I'm satisified we will get the best deal possible.
 

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I'm A Banana

Potassium-Rich
If their media properties are successful, then their analysis of "What we do to the OGL doesn't matter, any negative reaction is small peanuts compared to the money we could make with our media efforts, and doing this to the OGL helps protect our media properties" will have been shown to be correct.

They're wagering Chris Pine, Forgotten Realms IP, etc. will make them more money than they'd lose from OGL fallout. Maybe it's not an unreasonable bet.
 

Scribe

Legend
1. WotC has already lost, they've walked back almost everything, and a lot of what's left that folks hate will be dust from the D&D Beyond boycott and hardcover boycott. The last, biggest part the OGL 1.0a revocation is already on shaky ground because of internal opposition, bad PR, and the current TTRPG boycott, and WotC has no legal case to revoke the OGL not even counting the perpetual vs irrevokible issue, they will lose any court case Paizo and others bring against them, which will come, and in the extremely unlikely scenario that WotC wins, Paizo will likely get an injunction against revoking OGL 1.0a until the case is resolved, which could take years to resolve, destroying WotC schedule and making One D&D ompossible to release next year. This is a no win scenerio for them and the smallest loses are letting go of the new OGL altogether.

2. I don't blame WotC for this, I blame CEO Chris Cocks, WotC President Cynthia Williams, and D&D Vice President Rawson, those are my targets, not WotC. I've learned its more effective to go after corporate leadership then a corporation.

3. Most of the damage this will do has already been done, most 3pp aren't coming back for the foreseeable future.

4. The Forgotten Realms has been severly under supportered in 5e, especially mid to late 5e, FR needs this movie and it's novels. Frankly FR setting is more important to me then D&D, so that is my priorities. Not that things will get worse for D&D see point 1.

I will continue to support the D&D Beyond and TTRPG hardcover boycott until I'm satisified we will get the best deal possible.

You start with a flawed premise.

You go after leadership, by targeting the corporate bottom line.

False.

Your desire for FR outweighs your feelings towards the corporation. You could just say that.

Without boycotting their hopes and dreams at being a mass media darling, you are supporting Hasbro and Wizards.

Your choice, you don't have to try and justify it.
 


J.Quondam

CR 1/8
No, Hasbro/WotC has not "lost" yet. Until they release the actual text of OGL2.0, we have no idea what their final stance will be.

Just be aware that supporting this D&D movie/media push pays right into their "under-monetized D&D lifestyle brand", and makes the OGL mess that much less relevant in the context of the larger business. And that is exactly what benecktied money-squids want.
 


As of right now, unless I missed something the OGL 1.0a is still authorized. WotC has started walking back on a lot of things, let's see if they continue to do so.

As far as the movie, I plan to see it. I plan to see it because I want good D&D movies. This one shows promise. I understand people's feelings towards it all but I've been waiting a long time for a good D&D movie.
 


TheAlkaizer

Game Designer
1. WotC has already lost, they've walked back almost everything, and a lot of what's left that folks hate will be dust from the D&D Beyond boycott and hardcover boycott. The last, biggest part the OGL 1.0a revocation is already on shaky ground because of internal opposition, bad PR, and the current TTRPG boycott, and WotC has no legal case to revoke the OGL not even counting the perpetual vs irrevokible issue, they will lose any court case Paizo and others bring against them, which will come, and in the extremely unlikely scenario that WotC wins, Paizo will likely get an injunction against revoking OGL 1.0a until the case is resolved, which could take years to resolve, destroying WotC schedule and making One D&D ompossible to release next year. This is a no win scenerio for them and the smallest loses are letting go of the new OGL altogether.
You can't be sure of 80% of what you're saying in there. We've had lawyers, involved individuals and companies proclaim things on every point of the legal continuum. The main takeaway from this whole affair is that we just don't know. And WoTC will exploit this legal ambiguity and the shadow threat of lawsuits to force their way through this.

And they haven't walked back on almost everything. They walked back on a handful of hyper-restrictive clauses that are now only super-restrictives. The one thing they need to do, which is to not deauthorize the previous versions of the OGL hasn't been done yet. Unless they update the OGL and make it irrevocable or move the OGL into the hands of a neutral party like Paizo intends to do with the ORC, then it's no good.

2. I don't blame WotC for this, I blame CEO Chris Cocks, WotC President Cynthia Williams, and D&D Vice President Rawson, those are my targets, not WotC. I've learned its more effective to go after corporate leadership then a corporation.
It's useless to go after the leadership. Leadership changes quite often. Shareholders remain and their strategy doesn't change, they want more value out of the corporation they own. Cocks, Williams and Rawson could all leave and others would take their place.

3. Most of the damage this will do has already been done, most 3pp aren't coming back for the foreseeable future.
The fact that the damage is already done is a terrible reason to stop boycotting a corporation. You boycott a corporation because they're walking a bad path, yes. But if they keep on it then you don't stop. What kind of message is that sending? If you push through with your naughty word practices, we'll stop boycotting you. The fact that damage was done is the reason for the boycott.

4. The Forgotten Realms has been severly under supportered in 5e, especially mid to late 5e, FR needs this movie and it's novels. Frankly FR setting is more important to me then D&D, so that is my priorities. Not that things will get worse for D&D see point 1.
Forgotten Realms is a property of the greedy shareholders that are currently attempting to destroying the whole industry and twenty years of material. I don't see how you liking a setting has anything to do with that? Forgotten Realms does not need that movie. All the movie is gonna do is lead to them selling stickers, and T-shirts, and plastic toys, and mugs and every type of garbage they can churn out. It will not lead to a careful and respectful handling of the source material.
 



MarkB

Legend
As of right now, unless I missed something the OGL 1.0a is still authorized. WotC has started walking back on a lot of things, let's see if they continue to do so.

As far as the movie, I plan to see it. I plan to see it because I want good D&D movies. This one shows promise. I understand people's feelings towards it all but I've been waiting a long time for a good D&D movie.
The problem is, it's things like the D&D movie, more than the forthcoming release of the next edition, that are spurring the current attempted changes. With D&D growing into a true entertainment brand, this is how Hasbro / WotC intend to protect that brand.

If we can't have the movies and the TV shows and the merchandising without them resorting to these business practices, maybe we were better off without them.
 




DMZ2112

Chaotic Looseleaf
I can't help but feel like you've got this backward. Wizards Corporate has got to be watching the growth of their multimedia empire way more closely than they are watching the books. D&D Beyond has an inflated presence on the balance sheets because they just spent All The Money on it and expect it to return that investment, but -- and reasonable minds could disagree -- I would not expect a physical book boycott to even register with them. At the very least, not until oneD&D launches.

Why I continue to support D&D's multimedia efforts.

1. Chris Pine is dreamy.

2. There is no two.
Honestly, I have hopes for this film for one reason. Years ago, I went into Star Trek expecting to be annoyed and disappointed, and then I got to the series of scenes early on where McCoy vaccinates Kirk against something alien and virulent and Kirk develops a severe allergic reaction.

Laughed my ass off. I still sit a bit lopsided. Nearly made up for the rest of the script. Karl Urban's contribution to that bit can't be overstated, but Pine sells it.

Don't mistake me -- I know exactly what that was, and why it happened so early in the movie. It's not so much anything more than Urban and Pine doing their best Kelley and Shatner impressions. But I gave up on Hollywood a long time ago. That is all I want from this movie, for it to be honest with the source material and slapstick funny (and not at the expense of dwarves). I have zero interest in the idea of a D&D drama.

To contradict the words of the inestimable Damodar, "This is absolutely a game."
 


J.Quondam

CR 1/8
1.0a is NOT revoked and 2.0 is already dead, 2.0 had royalties still, whatever comes next, if anything, won't. It's why 2.0, along with 1.1 was never released.

Yes, they said they'll remove some odious conditions from the new OGL, but they were silent on other big questions. They absolutely have not killed it off entirely, as they indicated in their announcement a couple days ago:

A couple of last thoughts. First, we won’t be able to release the new OGL today, because we need to make sure we get it right, but it is coming.

"It is coming." And so it's still possible that there will be bad news, including the status of future OGL1.0 materials, which was one of the things they were silent on and that happens to be important to me.
.
 

The problem is, it's things like the D&D movie, more than the forthcoming release of the next edition, that are spurring the current attempted changes. With D&D growing into a true entertainment brand, this is how Hasbro / WotC intend to protect that brand.

If we can't have the movies and the TV shows and the merchandising without them resorting to these business practices, maybe we were better off without them.

I disagree, the Forgotten Realms has never been covered by the OGL, same with Eberron, DL, Ravenloft, Exandria, Spelljammer, Planescape, Theros, or Ravnica, even stuff like Radiant Citadel isn't, so Paramount doesn't care about the OGL, neither does Larian Studios, the new OGL is entirely about One D&D and D&D Beyond for different reasons. This was never about the multimedia empire, all the stuff draws from actual settings, it's not impacted by OGL at all.
 

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