Why is Ice Storm a higher level spell than Fireball?

[Derren]

But why not put fireball on scroll instead. Ice storm max 5d6 whereas Fireball can be 10d6 if the thing gets unlucky.

Because when casted from a scroll, the save DC will be crappy.
Also, for higher damage you have to scribe the scroll at a higher caster level, making it more expensive.

Ice Storm has no Save and you don't need to increase the caster level.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

It's utility against rogues and monks isn't "marginal", it's devestating. They can ignore the effects of much higher level spells, but can't escape the 5d6 from Ice Storm.

I phrased that poorly, though you'll still likely disagree. The ability to get past evasion is a marginal benefit. Unless you team up with wolverine and fight gangs of the hand ninja every episode its just not that big of a deal because evasion is on what 2 core classes. I'm not going to bump into it nearly enough for its reduced damage vs everything else to balance it at one level higher than fireball.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

Because when casted from a scroll, the save DC will be crappy.
Also, for higher damage you have to scribe the scroll at a higher caster level, making it more expensive.

Ice Storm has no Save and you don't need to increase the caster level.

Lets see for a wand
fireball: 10x3x750=22500.
Ice Storm: 7x4x750=21000

So you save a whoping 1500 GP for a wand that even with the crap DC of a fireball item usually worse but is better vs evasion people. At best ice storm balnaces out magic item wise, but is weaker spell wise.

 

[Destil]

I'm fairly tempted to bring the damage to d4s but make it 3rd level and part of the sleet storm spell, myself. Havn't gotten around to re-working it, yet.

Now if you want something extremly underpowered, take a look at flaming shroud from the PsiHB. Reflex to negate, only works on one large or smaller creature, 11d6 fire damage. And that's a 6th (!?!?) level power.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

Historically (prior to this edition of D&D), ice storm and sleet storm were a single spell -- you got to choose at casting which effect you wanted. In 3rd Edition they separated them out, at the same level, without any compensation for the reduced functionality.

I think a dual purpose version could justify being a 4th level spell.

If the damage were changed to 4d6 the 3e version of Ice Storm would make a fine 3rd level spell.

 

[thegreatbuddha]

Personally, I've house ruled it. Ice Sotrm/Sleet storm is a 4th level spell (you choose which effect upon casting) and it deals 1d10 cold damage, 2d10 bludgeoning.

 

[LordAO]

On thing to keep in mind is that the bludgeoning damage is as much a disadvanatge as an advantage. Sure, cold immune creatures can still be hit, but anything that takes double damage from cold will only double the 2d6. And don't bother using energy admixture either...

Ice Storm just plain blows. It should be a 2nd level spell, even with no saving throw.

 

[Destil]

After some thoughgt I came to the conclusion: Ice Storm's problem is that it dosn't scale. At 7th level it's fine, over 70% damage vs. fireball. But once you hit 10th it's stuck at 50%. Non-save spells should most likely do about 75% of the damage of save for half spells, a nice balance between reliability and power.
I also wanted to fold sleet storm back into it, I was never been a big fan of that change.
Thus my own ice storm house rule:

Sleet Storm/Ice Storm: Sleet storm is not used.

Ice Storm is 4th level with two versions (chosen at casting).

Hail Storm: As Ice Storm. If the caster is at least 8th level it deals 3d6 cold + 3d6 bludgeoning damage, if the caster is at least 10th level it deals 3d6 cold + 4d6 bludgeoning.

Sleet Storm: As the 3rd level spell.