Why Is the Cleric Unfun?

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I reject this idea completely. It's not entertaining or enjoyable to help others? To work as a team? To be Mr. Fix-it? To be, most often, the single most important guy on the team? To be the one guy that the team can't afford to have go down, because everything else can be recovered from? To be the most flexible guy on the team in and out of combat? To be the one guy on the team who can always contribute in every situation because you are almost as good of a spell caster as the wizard(s), and/or almost as good of a combatant as the fighter(s). That's not fun? If that isn't fun, I'm not sure what is.

If anything, the 3.X Cleric is _too fun_, _too attractive_, _too good_ and almost makes it so that, "Why would anyone ever play anything else?" is a legitimate question. You can play 'a party of clerics' and cover every role in the party far better than you can with any other class. You can have a cleric fighter (defender), a cleric wizard (blaster), a cleric cleric (leader), and with a bit of help from a PrC and a little multiclassing, a cleric rogue. I only wish every class was as well designed, as versital in role playing situations, as versital in character creation, as useful over a wide range of levels, and as fun to play as the Cleric.

The Cleric is not an example of something in 3.X that needs fixing. It's an example of something that all the other classes should be aspiring to. I would have thought that the designers would be looking at the cleric and saying, "This is the class that we did just about right. Let's make all the classes more like this."

I think a party of Cleric would play very different from playing a single Cleric. If there is only one Cleric, he is the healer (and buffer). If you enjoy that, this is certainly a good class, but if you want to do more, it's difficult.

In a party, everybody can heal himself, or only one of the Clerics is delegated to be the healer. The other Clerics can use the fun spells and wade into melee.

--

What I really wonder is: How can there be so different experiences with Clerics? What are the differences in the combat I (and others with the "Clerics = unfun" experience) run, and those that enjoy playing their Clerics (if it isn't just that they are fine with being the healer)?

I know that I usually play in a group with 3 other party members, and that we often run 25-point buy characters in Paizos Adventure Paths or other published modules, often playing slightly underpowered compared to our opposition. Optimised combat tactics and character builds are very important in these games. But this doesn't mean we are actually that good at it, though I think we are...

 

[lukelightning]

I shy away from clerics until I can figure out if the DM is one of those DMs.

You know the ones who run a world in which your Deity isn't just a god, it's also a boss. And not just a boss, a micromanaging boss that, despite being Neutral Good, is more likely Chaotic Neutral because he/she likes to randomly mess with your granted spells and punish you by stripping away your powers for violating tenets of the relgion that, despite your 9 ranks in Knowledge (religion) you were unaware of.

 

[Patlin]

Clerics are fun in 3.x, especially at high levels. 4e will likely present a very different play experience for the cleric, though. At least one of the abilities described so far sounded more like a crusader maneuver than a boring old cure light wounds.

 

[Doug McCrae]

You can have a cleric fighter (defender), a cleric wizard (blaster), a cleric cleric (leader)

Doesn't that show the cleric (along with the druid) needs fixing? The class is too good at too many things. It has no weaknesses.

To reduce their power I'm thinking of using favoured soul spell selection for clerics and druids, plus PHB2 wildshape as mandatory, next time I run 3.5.

 

[Clavis]

The problem is when clerics are only played for their mechanical capabilities, which are focused on supporting other players. It's easy to forget why the clerics has these abilities - to help convert other people to their cause! Remember, clerics weren't intended to represent the mainline clergy of their religions. They're crusading missionaries, righteous champions of their god. A correctly played cleric ought to be constantly lecturing the other PCs on religion. The cleric shouldn't just cast Cure Light Wounds on someone. He should first say something like, "Do you BELIEVE in the power of Pelor? Do you BELIEVE in his might? Then your faith shall heal you!"

Any character class is boring when reduced to their mechanics. Its the roleplaying that makes them interesting, and the cleric class is rich with roleplaying possibilities. IMHO Clerics should only be able to use their spells when it furthers the cause of their deity. The DM should insist that PCs pay at least lip service to the cleric's religion in order for the cleric's miracles to benefit them. That'll completely change the tone of play, and create endless role-playing opportunities.

 

[Simia Saturnalia]

I think the real problem is this:
Think about the last time your gaming table cheered another player's critical/max damage roll/save-or-lose spell the BBEG fails his save on.

Now think about the last time your gaming table cheered the cleric's maxed out cure roll.

The cleric isn't unfun. He's unappreciated, except maybe in the afterstory ("...and Ted's cleric totally saved our collective backsides!"). Nobody wants to be the guy who's just fulfilling his obligations.

 

[National Acrobat]

I don't think Clerics are unfun at all to play, but then again, as a GM, I place the emphasis for those who play clerics, on following the tenets of their faith, which comes in direct conflict a lot of times with the stereotypical cleric model we are all familiar with. Plainly put, not all faiths place an emphasis on healing and being nice. In some cases, some faiths prohibit healing others, and to some extent, prohibit healing those of other faiths. My players love this approach, and it really has led to some great role playing in many of my past campaigns.

 

[JDJblatherings]

Turn Undead - is prety darned useful and curiosuly underated for an abiltiy that makes a whole type of monster go "poof".

Been playing a version of the game where clerics don't get spells at 1st level. That sort of drops the whole "party-band aid" on it's back and kicks it to death. If someone's cleric is just a healer, the player and the DM are boring.

 

[JDJblatherings]

I think the real problem is this:
Think about the last time your gaming table cheered another player's critical/max damage roll/save-or-lose spell the BBEG fails his save on.

Now think about the last time your gaming table cheered the cleric's maxed out cure roll.
.

That would have been lastnight.

 

[National Acrobat]

If someone's cleric is just a healer, the player and the DM are boring.

So true, so true. I couldn't have said it any better.