why on earth does the bard only get 4 skill points/lvl???
- Thread starter Negative Zero
- Start date
Dr. Zoom said:
What I find interesting is that except for the rogue, people think that all the other classes don't get enough skill points. In fact, some thing the rogue needs more in order to master the "Thief" skills.
When 3rd Ed came out, I though that there were not enough skill point all around as well. But that just means a player must choose what to do. If all bards had 6 skill point base, you would start seeing less distinction between bards. The limited skill points force all character to specialize in their lower levels. But as you progress, you don't need to keep all skills maxed out.
Personally, I am against giving one class bonus skill points. However IMC, I would consider giving all classes an additonal base2 skill points.
-The Luddite
Trousers
First Post
More like Master of One...
Eryx: not to turn this thread into the "Bard's Suck" thread on the Wotc boards, but I'd like to refute your claim of "jack of all trades, master of none"...
A ranger, monk, and bard all have 4 sp. But if the bard wants to cast spells and use bardic music, Perform is an absolute must.
Furthermore if he wants to be a half-decent spell caster, concentration is a must... spellcraft a maybe...
Now we're down to 1-2 sp, and the RgrMnk still have 4. Via cross-classing it would be quite easy for a Rgr/Mnk to match or even "out-bard" the bard.
6 sp allows the bard to keep the jack of all trades w/o "out-roguing" the rogue.
There are a lot of great things about the 3E bard class, but there a few very big holes like this that really degrade the bard's purpose -- and chance for survival -- in a good D&D game.
Agree/disagree?
Eryx: not to turn this thread into the "Bard's Suck" thread on the Wotc boards, but I'd like to refute your claim of "jack of all trades, master of none"...
A ranger, monk, and bard all have 4 sp. But if the bard wants to cast spells and use bardic music, Perform is an absolute must.
Furthermore if he wants to be a half-decent spell caster, concentration is a must... spellcraft a maybe...
Now we're down to 1-2 sp, and the RgrMnk still have 4. Via cross-classing it would be quite easy for a Rgr/Mnk to match or even "out-bard" the bard.
6 sp allows the bard to keep the jack of all trades w/o "out-roguing" the rogue.
There are a lot of great things about the 3E bard class, but there a few very big holes like this that really degrade the bard's purpose -- and chance for survival -- in a good D&D game.
Agree/disagree?
KnowTheToe
First Post
Does it really matter, cause who plays a bard anyway???
I think the Bard and Ranger get hosed with 4 skill points/lvl. SIx works well and makes both character classes more diverse and usable. I think only the rogue and barbarian have the right amount of points, no class should have less than four. I would also like a broader class skill list for fighters, or variant core fighter classes with different subclasses of character skills.
I think the Bard and Ranger get hosed with 4 skill points/lvl. SIx works well and makes both character classes more diverse and usable. I think only the rogue and barbarian have the right amount of points, no class should have less than four. I would also like a broader class skill list for fighters, or variant core fighter classes with different subclasses of character skills.
Negative Zero
First Post
er ... actually ... um ... i'm playing a bard *sheepish look* since my last character was dealing out 40+ dmg/round at 7th lvl, i wanted to try something opposite. 
seriously tho, i agree that the PHB ranger doen't get enough as well. i also think that mages and ESPECIALLY clerics get shafted with the SPs too. (altho i can see the "higher intelligence balancing factor with the mage" argument.)
so what you got against the bard, huh? HUH??!!
~NegZ
seriously tho, i agree that the PHB ranger doen't get enough as well. i also think that mages and ESPECIALLY clerics get shafted with the SPs too. (altho i can see the "higher intelligence balancing factor with the mage" argument.)so what you got against the bard, huh? HUH??!!
~NegZ
KnowTheToe
First Post
Negative Zero said:er ... actually ... um ... i'm playing a bard *sheepish look* since my last character was dealing out 40+ dmg/round at 7th lvl, i wanted to try something opposite.
so what you got against the bard, huh? HUH??!!
~NegZ
I have nothing against the bard. I was actually excited to try one when 3rd edition first came out, but I have had a hard time finding good motivations for the class.
Anabstercorian
First Post
It's not THAT big of a difference either way. I don't recommend you bother your DM to the point of anger over it, but do try and get him to understand where you're coming from.
Droogie
Explorer
I played a bard in our last campaign. I liked him, but I did feel shorted in the sk pts. Thats all the bard needs to fix him up. Just those two lousy skill points, and he would have been perfect. Same goes for the ranger, too. And we need to fiddle with that whole two weapon-fighting thing, but thats another thread. In fact, thats many many many many many MANY other threads.
So what happened to him you ask? Well, I tried supplementing his skill points by taking a level of rogue. I also thought maybe with the sneak attack, he could team up on enemies with his fighter/rogue brother. Unfortunately, I didn't take rogue at first level, thus shorting myself on sk pts again, but it doesn't matter, cuz we aaaaaaalllllll died.
But lets think about this. Apparently, the designers must have thought that with his arcane spellcasting and bardic music, 6 skill pts would have been overkill. Do we mostly disagree with this?
So what happened to him you ask? Well, I tried supplementing his skill points by taking a level of rogue. I also thought maybe with the sneak attack, he could team up on enemies with his fighter/rogue brother. Unfortunately, I didn't take rogue at first level, thus shorting myself on sk pts again, but it doesn't matter, cuz we aaaaaaalllllll died.
But lets think about this. Apparently, the designers must have thought that with his arcane spellcasting and bardic music, 6 skill pts would have been overkill. Do we mostly disagree with this?
Negative Zero
First Post
hey Droogie (cool name btw! ), i sure as heck don't agree with it! the two lousy extra point would have made the class perfect! hence my gripe here! 
Anabstercorian, i certainly don't intend to be a pain about it. the DM's a real nice guy, plus it's his first time, so i'm not gonna difficult or anything ... tho from what i hear, that's inevitable when it comes to me. lol just trying to look out for my PC is all
on and CamelToe (now that's a hilarious name! :thumbs up: ) as for motivations, check this out. it's another thread i started specifically about my bard.
~NegZ
), i sure as heck don't agree with it! the two lousy extra point would have made the class perfect! hence my gripe here! Anabstercorian, i certainly don't intend to be a pain about it. the DM's a real nice guy, plus it's his first time, so i'm not gonna difficult or anything ... tho from what i hear, that's inevitable when it comes to me. lol just trying to look out for my PC is all
on and CamelToe (now that's a hilarious name! :thumbs up: ) as for motivations, check this out. it's another thread i started specifically about my bard.
~NegZ
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