D&D 5E Why Would I Play a Ranger?

[jodyjohnson]

I've dogged some on the ranger, as I feel one of their paths (beastmaster) is underpowered unless you pick the snake option, ...

Let colossus slayer apply to each attack, rather than once per turn.

Beastmaster is lacking, here's a buff for Hunters

Move the bonus attack from dual wielding to the attack action, freeing up their bonus action for spellcasting.

In general or just for Rangers? Looks like a buff for Hunters.

Remove spells known entirely and grant them all of them, as Paladin's dont have to deal with that crap. Add 2 cantrips at 1st level and scale up to 4 at 16th level. At 17th level let them cast Hunter's Mark as a 4th level spell once per short rest.

Also general Ranger boost. Where's your Beastmaster love?

Not to say those aren't issues some people have with the Ranger class.

Jody -- spooning with his panther.

 

[Fedge123]

"Why would I play a Ranger?"

I don't play one usually, but I will answer for my son - he LOVES the Ranger, specifically the Beastmaster. He just loves the idea of having a beast companion (wolf).

Overall, I think the Ranger is really cool, the concept is great, it has some unique abilities, especially if your campaign involves a lot of wilderness travel/adventure. Beastmaster, archer, hunter, tracker, some spells, guarding and patrolling the wilderness edges of civilization, etc ... the fluff is great. I'd ask, "Why wouldn't you want a Ranger in your group?"

 

[Sacrosanct]

I don't think beastmaster's are nearly as underpowered as people think they are. You essentially give up one of your attacks for your pet to attack. Looking at most of the pets, and they have things like pack tactics, knocking target's prone, etc. Those are pretty significant abilities. If you gave a class an ability "when you hit your target, it must make a STR save or be knocked prone", no one would be complaining. In fact, if anything, people would say that's too OP compared to the BM fighter who can only do things like that a # of times = to their superiority dice. And since you can get another companion after 8 hours, the pet is essentially a regenerating resource of a bag of hit points to soak up damage that would otherwise go to you or your party members.

 

[Mistwell]

Here, I think these two threads will answer your question very well:

The Outdoorsman's Guide to natural Ranging
Into the Woods We Go

 

[Salamandyr]

I don't see that at all. In this edition I see:
*trackers/hunters
*good at fighting both in melee and ranged (maybe not as good as a fighter)
* light spell casters

The Ranger overall is fine, the Hunter is fine, but the Beastmaster does suffer a bit from having to sacrifice your action to do anything with the animal companion.

Edit: In case I came across as snarky I apologize. I've been awake for 25 hours and I did not mean to be rude.

s'All good. I don't disagree with you (except for the 1e Ranger, which was clearly intended to be "Fighter, but better-because Aragorn"), but I think archery is, and has always been a big component of the rangers schtick, even when it wasn't been mechanically optimized for it. And I think it's reasonable for someone to say "I want to play an awesome archer, like Robin Hood. Ooh look, Ranger!"

If the OP were right, that a ranger was no better, and often worse than other classes at archery, I would totally understand someone saying "why play a ranger?" Fortunately that's not actually the case. They're awesome at archery.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

Beastmaster is lacking, here's a buff for Hunters


In general or just for Rangers? Looks like a buff for Hunters.


Also general Ranger boost. Where's your Beastmaster love?

Not to say those aren't issues some people have with the Ranger class.

Jody -- spooning with his panther.

The dual wield is actually for everyone with either the feat or the style. It helps fighters with action surge and closes the gap in general.

I didnt post any beastmaster fixes because I'd rather just let all rangers have a pet, and run it as an NPC, and mostly ditch the subclass entirely. Paladins get a pretty good mount at 5th level that can act on it's own, including taking the help action (and talk) and that's in addition to the massive edge paladins already have over rangers. My wife's remaking her 3e ranger for a one shot, and I just encouraged her to play a hunter, and I'll have her giant badger essentially be a low level barbarian NPC ally with re-fluffed abilities.

However off the cuff, fixes would be to grant the beast ability increases or a feat whenever the beastmaster also gets one. A snake with sentinel or a bear with grappler would certainly help elevate the pet. I'd give the beast a number of d8 Hit Dice equal to half the ranger level. This lets the pet heal during short rests. Once you command the beast to attack, it continues to attack the same target until you command it to do otherwise (the benefit from Beasial Fury still only applies when you use one of your attacks however). I would remove the restriction on using Exceptional Training to let it be used on turns when the beast attacks. Lastly I would grant the beast proficiency in dexterity and constitution saves (as it stands, most beasts have no save proficiency, so the ability to use the ranger's proficiency bonus in saves they are proficient in doesnt really matter)

Oh, I'd also restore the beast resurrection ritual from 4th edition, so if you want to get your particular panther back you can with minimal fuss. That way its not a revolving door of throwaway pets.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

I don't think beastmaster's are nearly as underpowered as people think they are. You essentially give up one of your attacks for your pet to attack. Looking at most of the pets, and they have things like pack tactics, knocking target's prone, etc. Those are pretty significant abilities. If you gave a class an ability "when you hit your target, it must make a STR save or be knocked prone", no one would be complaining. In fact, if anything, people would say that's too OP compared to the BM fighter who can only do things like that a # of times = to their superiority dice. And since you can get another companion after 8 hours, the pet is essentially a regenerating resource of a bag of hit points to soak up damage that would otherwise go to you or your party members.

That's fine if you dont allow feats. But the opportunity cost of giving up a sharpshooter arrow is pretty high. And "beasts" dont have things like pack tactics and prone. That's one specific beast that has both, and the panther can prone on what is essentially a charge attack. Plus the DC is a whopping 11 or 12 on the panther. Lots of pets dont get much. The guy who picks a falcoln? Sorry pal, chump choice on your part. Should have picked the 1-2 beasts that are actually slightly useful. If you hand out magic weapons the beast will fall even more by the wayside.

Also, in general, beastmaster players arent likely to want to use the pet to set off traps and just consider it a bag of HP to be used as a party resource. Some might, if they are playing something like a callous gnoll ranger. But in general, the type of player who would pick the beastmaster ranger class tends to have an emotional investment in the creature. I've seen players get more upset at the death of their beast than the death of their ranger.

 

[Gnashtooth]

Some might, if they are playing something like a callous gnoll ranger.

HEY! I resemble that remark!

And my original idea for a hyena beastmaster gnoll ranger was not to have it spring traps

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

HEY! I resemble that remark!

And my original idea for a hyena beastmaster gnoll ranger was not to have it spring traps

Heh, I love gnoll rangers. Their iconic nature in 3E helped remove the idea of the ranger as some kind of tree hugging hippy, and reinforced the idea that the ranger can be someone who lives in nature and uses it as a tool, but doesnt necessarily revere it.

 

[Zardnaar]

To the OP that ranger is not very good thats why. Also even beastmasters can use hunters mark. Anyway by level 8 have an 18 dex + the sharpshooter feats. YOu now have.
+9 to hit (+3 prof, +4 dex, +2 style)
Do not get the -2 to hit for firing through allies/cover.

Can use the -5+10 damage part of sharpshooter (have an ally buff you).

Damage jumps up to,
1d8+14, 1d8+14 at +4 to hit.

With hunters mark add an extra d6.

Hunter gets an extra 1d8 in there as well or perhaps a 3rd attack. A good ranger (hunter) is looking at.

2d8+1d6+14/1d8+1d6+14 damage

Thats something like 49.5 avg damage per round at +4 to hit, 29.5 avg damage at +9 to hit.

I have a tempest ranger in the party, dex based melee and he gets 3 and often 4 attacks a round at level 9 and gets hasted as well. 1d8+5+hunters mark adds up to af damage fast.