Will all of you Ebberon-buyers become Blackmoor-buyers?

[DClingman]

At the risk of repeating previous posters, what's unique about Blackmoor? Everything that has been presented so far is generic. With mulple settings out there for 3e already, it seems you've pulled the flavour out of the campaign for the generic. I assume this was to appeal to a broader base of people who never heard of Blackmoor. But we keep coming back to the question, with every thing from Forgotten Realms to Arcana Unearthed out there, what's setting Blackmoor apart? In the past it was the elements you pulled out, now all we see are 'new' races and classes. Sorry to tell you, thats been done already.

Well actually we didn't take those elements out at all. What's unique about Blackmoor beyond the core feel of the world is indeed things like the clock and steam technology. That's not removed at all. In fact you can see detailed pics of the items in the gallery section of the Zeitgeist Games website. What we "didn't do yet" was to apply a large segment of the book to what would effectively amount to item creation rules for the tech elements. We had alot of things to crank into this book and with only 240 pages, there wasn't enough space for those.

I will say this. I am flexible. If enough people *really* want those rules, I will go back and discuss the possibility of moving those "rules" (which is exactly what they are) up in the publication schedule.

Btw, I just spoke with Joe Goodman. He has the books in hand! They turned out awesome by his account.

Dustin

 

[goodmangames]

At the risk of repeating previous posters, what's unique about Blackmoor?... Sorry to tell you, thats been done already.

That's correct, it's been done already. It was done in 1974 by Dave Arneson, in a little booklet called Blackmoor. That's why it's called the First Fantasy Campaign.

Blackmoor is D&D. It's one of the two worlds that eventually created the game now called Dungeons & Dragons. Labeling it "generic" because several generations of game designers have imitated it (often badly) is missing the point. Reading Blackmoor is like drinking from the cool mountain waters out of which the muddied river of d20 product flows.

OK, I'm getting a little carried away with the metaphors but I think you see my point.

By the way, UPS delivered the advance copies of Blackmoor today, and the book looks amazing. For those of you who are undecided, I say simply this: check out the book. Not every book is right for every gamer. But if you have any interest in D&D the way it is meant to be played -- with great imagination, with epic swords & sorcery, with brooding danger around every corner, with dragons so powerful they shake the earth -- then you need to check out Blackmoor.

 

[rangerjohn]

Well actually we didn't take those elements out at all. What's unique about Blackmoor beyond the core feel of the world is indeed things like the clock and steam technology. That's not removed at all. In fact you can see detailed pics of the items in the gallery section of the Zeitgeist Games website. What we "didn't do yet" was to apply a large segment of the book to what would effectively amount to item creation rules for the tech elements. We had alot of things to crank into this book and with only 240 pages, there wasn't enough space for those.

I will say this. I am flexible. If enough people *really* want those rules, I will go back and discuss the possibility of moving those "rules" (which is exactly what they are) up in the publication schedule.

Btw, I just spoke with Joe Goodman. He has the books in hand! They turned out awesome by his account.

Dustin

I don't neccasarily[sp?] need 'creation' rules for the tech items. But stats for premade items, like in the modules would be nice. I saw the pictures, but is that all there is, or are there stats to back them up? At least some, I think thats what people are saying, we don't need every item in the world, but the important one such as the egg, and a sampling of others would be nice.

 

[Coreyartus]

Ummm, I think what Dustin is trying to say is you'll have to wait and see. He's already taken time out of his days to tell you more about Blackmoor than you knew before. Count your blessings and ease up. He's not going to give you an all-access pass--yer gonna have to go to a game store and check out a preview copy, like he said. Give the guy a break and let him retain a little bit of the mystery behind his product--you'll know soon enough.

Deciding what goes into the product is his job. He gets paid the bucks to make decisions like that, and he knows more than we do about all the factors involved in making those tough choices. That's why he's working on the project, and not us. We can suggest what might be nice to see, but cutting down his product before you've even seen it because you don't have the exact details you want instantly in your hot little hands so you can summarily pass judgement... well, I'm sorry but in my experience that's just rude.

Are are you guys the kind that opens your Christmas presents early?

Coreyartus

 

[Menchi]

http://www.goodman-games.com/4500preview.php


I mean, after developing in Arneson's head for thirty years, how could it possibly go wrong? We'll find out in a few weeks, I suppose.

LONG LIVE THE THOUL!!!!!!!

Nah - no interest in Blackmoor.

 

[Nisarg]

I will say this. I am flexible. If enough people *really* want those rules, I will go back and discuss the possibility of moving those "rules" (which is exactly what they are) up in the publication schedule.

Btw, I just spoke with Joe Goodman. He has the books in hand! They turned out awesome by his account.

Dustin

Dustin, let me say that you have been excellent at responding to our concerns here on this thread. A lot of "designers" or professionals that come on to Enworld or RPG.net blindly defend their product and are only here to listen to praise or condemn any criticism of their work.

On the other hand, you've been attentive to our concerns and willing to work with us in discussing our legitimate interest in making Blackmoor successful and excellent.

I would strongly recommend you consider including the stats for some of the steampower and ultratech as soon in the release schedule as possible, and obviously in the design sense choosing to make it an important, rather than peripheral, part of the setting. Its clearly something that hits gamer's imaginations, and that they find cool and exciting. You have to give the customer what they want, right?

But again, congratulations and thanks for all your help in this! Your attention and care speaks volumes to the level of commitment you have to the setting and to your customers.

Nisarg

 

[DClingman]

Thanks for the compliments.

Here's a preview from Silven Crossroads:
http://www.silven.com/adnd.asp?case=show&id=395

Just came out today.

Dustin

 

[D+1]

I would strongly recommend you consider including the stats for some of the steampower and ultratech as soon in the release schedule as possible, and obviously in the design sense choosing to make it an important, rather than peripheral, part of the setting. Its clearly something that hits gamer's imaginations, and that they find cool and exciting. You have to give the customer what they want, right?

The problem with that goes to something Dustin said earlier - this is Dave Arneson's Blackmoor and I think Dave is more interested in presenting HIS Blackmoor than Blackmoor as somebody else wants it. I may have little to base the following opinion on, but it's long been my perception that while Dave INCLUDED laser swords, robots, and crashed spaceships in Blackmoor those were not HARDCORE elements of the setting; they were not aspects of it that were emphasized or played up to the degree suggested - where you would want or need to include as much of the rules about them as possible in a core book.

When you include a market price for a laser sword you automatically suggest that a laser sword can and would be bought on an open market. When you include rules for steampunk and clockwork creation in core rules you automatically suggest that these are common and strongly emphasized aspects of the setting - every time you open your Blackmoor book, there they are again and why aren't you constantly using them? Perhaps because those are not intended to be the primary foci of the setting. It's part of the bulk of the cake, just the icing. It is in part because of Blackmoor that I have always liked a little Science Fiction in my fantasy settings - but I strongly tend not to like fantasy settings that are only thinly disguised versions of science fiction, nor science fiction that simply has a little fantasy mixed in. YMMV.

 

[rogueattorney]

It's an often made mistake, but the answer is a definite no. I do know the real identity of the EGG and it remains a secret.

And not a very well kept one at that. If I recall, about a year ago, the "real" EGG popped up on the (since vanished) Yahoo Blackmoor group and, more or less, admitted his identity.

R.A.

 

[DClingman]

And not a very well kept one at that. If I recall, about a year ago, the "real" EGG popped up on the (since vanished) Yahoo Blackmoor group and, more or less, admitted his identity.

R.A.

Actually that was not the case. The Blackmoor d20 Yahoo group is still around, so I am not sure why you thought it was gone. Here's the link: http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/d20blackmoor/

You can go back and read through the posts. If anything, I beleive someone else who did know the EGG's identity mentioned that he knew who it was. That was most assuredly not the Egg of Coot. I have not ever personally spoken to the EGG and I bet he has no idea about the Blackmoor revival.

Dustin