Xyxox
Hero
I haven't given WotC the benefit of the doubt where promised software is concerned since the great MAster Tools Vaporware debacle.
When they deliver on promised software, I'll start giving them the benefit of the doubt again.
Will the WOTC Gametable return or is it dead forever?
- Thread starter Silverblade The Ench
- Start date
I haven't given WotC the benefit of the doubt where promised software is concerned since the great MAster Tools Vaporware debacle.
When they deliver on promised software, I'll start giving them the benefit of the doubt again.
kenmarable
Hero
Just rumors that started about 5 minutes after they removed the links to them on the DDI web page. Considering that they have said they would re-examine priorities after the Character Builder was released, and they have a survey out asking exactly about this sort of thing, and having links to non-existent software for a year when you are trying to sell a subscription isn't very effective marketing, I'd say it's just a tad early to call them dead.
Until WotC says they are nixxed, I wouldn't believe the rumors going around. They are about as unsubstantiated as you can get. (Web page link disappears = multimillion dollar* projects canceled.)
So no worries yet at least.(Of course, if WotC is "re-examining priorities" and I really wanted to see a particular project get some loving, I might start making posts claiming it's dead in order to generate a thread like this with cries of support. And to be clear, I'm talking about the "folk" Silverblade mentions who have been posting the "news" that these projects are dead on several websites. I'm not talking about Silverblade's OP. If you're not paying careful attention and reading between the lines, it's easy to assume the Visualizer and VTT are canceled given how many people have been claiming that recently.)
* This is only a guess. But unless they only have 2 programmers strung out on Mountain Dew trying to do everything, I can see the costs easily getting into the low millions.
Fifth Element
Legend
If you mean the recent thread here, that was pure baseless speculation.
The internet: the most efficient rumour-spreading technology ever developed.
Brown Jenkin
First Post
If they move the pricing up for Game Table, I hope there's an option where you have a lesser subscription. I'm not interested in playing on the computer at all, and don't want to pay more for it.
I recall hearing they were having trouble with DRM. And such a program isn't simple to put together. "Just use the Quake engine"? Great - except are you going to expect every GM who uses it to render their game world as a Quake level? How are you going to intergrate that into the game rules, such as the turn-based nature?
Large multiplayer online games are not simple programs to write.
I recall hearing they were having trouble with DRM. And such a program isn't simple to put together. "Just use the Quake engine"? Great - except are you going to expect every GM who uses it to render their game world as a Quake level? How are you going to intergrate that into the game rules, such as the turn-based nature?
Large multiplayer online games are not simple programs to write.
JVisgaitis
Explorer
Does the Character Builder not count for some reason?
The Internet, home of the "Warped logic"...
CharlesRyan
Adventurer
By "deliver on promised software," do mean that the final product must exactly match the initial announcement, in content and timing of release?
If so, nothing they have announced to date could meet that definition. In other words, you will not extend the benefit of doubt until after they successfully release some software that they haven't yet announced. In other, other words, not for (presumably) quite some time at the earliest.
If not, what do you mean? They've delivered the Character Builder. Late, to be sure, but only by seven months, which isn't that long in the world of software. And it's pretty kick-ass; a few people have issues, but you can't please everyone.
El Mahdi
Muad'Dib of the Anauroch
WOW! Talk about revisionism and spin.
From my players handbook, first printing, June 2008:
Also every bit of advertising leading up to the release of 4E "promised" that these utilities would be ready at the time of 4E's release.
That statement from the Players Handbook, and all of the 4E advertising, defines exactly what "promised software" is. Getting cute, combative, and putting corporate spin on it won't change the fact that those products were promised at a specific time. And to date, only a percentage of them are up and running at full strength. One could also argue that the most touted of those applications, the Crown Jewel of D&D Insider, D&D Game Table, doesn't even exist yet.
And then to have the absurd gaul to ask in a poll whether or not "you trust WoTC to deliver quality digital products on time?"!
Let's recap:
Dragon Magazine / Dungeon Magazine - Up and running prior to the release of 4E, but did not truly reach the measure of a "quality" product until at least two or three issues in. The fact that customer feedback had to reach the point of aggressive combativeness on the part of would be customers before WoTC would listen and implement changes (i.e.: artwork galleries and keyed/unkeyed maps not being included, and people not buying subscriptions and being very vocally critical of WoTC until they were provided), is not a necesarily a mark against, but also definitely not deserving of Kudos either. All in all, delivered basically on time, with no more problems than would be expected. Not deserving of an outstanding grade, just a passing one. - B- (80%)
Compendium - Late in being implemented and updated (late meaning not up and running at the time of 4E's release as "promised"), but functional. Passing grade due to being functional but "marked down" because of
lateness. - C- (70%)
Tools - Not specifically mentioned or advertised, so we'll consider this extra credit. - A+ (100%)
Character Creator - As you so wonderfully spun it, "only seven months late". Spin it all you want. Tell yourself anything you want to make yourself feel better, but seven months late is not acceptable. - D (65%)
Character Visualizer - Not realeased yet with no public acknowledgement of when, or if, it will be completed. - F or "Incomplete" (0%)
Dungeon Creator - Not realeased yet with no public acknowledgement of when, or if, it will be completed. - F or "Incomplete" (0%)
Campaign Tools - Don't know if that's the name for it or not, but I'm talking about the utilities meant to allow players and DM's to save characters, monsters, and campaign information. - F or "Incomplete" (0%)
D&D Game Table - The Crown Jewel of the 4E sneakpeak at D&D experience in 2007. The most highly touted, advertised, and hype-inducing part of 4E. In all likely hood, probably won't be real, if at all, until the middle of 2010. Two years late. You can spin this all you want. You can say that these are expected and normal delays. But if these are expected and normal delays, they should have been factored into the equation when WoTC first decided to make a 4th Edition (in what 2004/2005?) and incorporate the aforementioned digital products. There is no "spin" that will change these facts. Delays of these sorts are not acceptable. - F or "Incomplete" (0%)
Overall grade for D&DI: 45% = F
If this had been more of a weighted grade, with the most important utilities garnering a higher percentage of the grade (such as the visualizer and game table), this grade would be much worse.
You're absolutely right, "you can't please everyone", (although I'd say it's more than just a "few" people who have issues with this - was that simply a mistake or more "spin" - you know, purposeful understatement), but a good start would have been actually accomplishing what WoTC said it would, when they said they would. They did not, and now cannot, accomplish that. No amount of "spin" will change that.
Because of the lateness of these products, even when (or if) they get released, they are looking at a grade, in probably most customers consideration, of at best a passing "B or C". Personally, if things do come out basically on time with our "revised" expectations, I'd only give them a "D" at best. And I feel I'm being generous.
They can continue to move the goalposts all they want. And people can accept that, and let WoTC off the hook, all they want. But I won't. They have screwed up, no amount of spin or re-imagining of expectations will change that. Let's stop trying to make an argument that WoTC didn't screw up and didn't deliver on promised software. That train already left the station.
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