Willful Disadvantage

[Hawk Diesel]

So I'm curious. Would any DM's here allow a player to choose or request to have disadvantage on a roll they normally wouldn't have disadvantage on?

Reason I'm asking is because I'm about to play a Kobold character that is a horrible liar. He gets visibly nervous and starts licking his eye (as reptiles do). I feel like anytime he would attempt deception rolls, he would be at disadvantage. But he doesn't have any mechanical reason for constant disadvantage. And this isn't a matter where I'm asking for any kind of compensating mechanical benefit (like advantage on insight checks). I'm not looking for anything like that.

And this got me thinking, in general how would you handle this at your table? Would you allow a player to request disadvantage?

 

[happyhermit]

Well, depending on the situation it might be an auto-failure for me, but I have no problem giving disadvantage for things like that, sounds interesting.

 

[Treantmonklvl20]

Advantage and Disadvantage are something a DM can arbitrate at need. If a player roleplays a deception check in a way that would suggest to me that the deception would be easier to discern, I would absolutely impose disadvantage. Alternatively, if the deception was roleplayed convincingly, I would impose advantage.

If a player requested disadvantage, i would have no issues with that. Likely, the way you describe roleplaying the deception, I would give you disadvantage anyways.

 

[iserith]

Players describe what they want to do, which doesn't include making an ability check or requesting advantage or disadvantage. So this would not fly at my table. I would recommend to the player that he or she should write the flaw "I have a 'tell' that reveals I'm lying" on his or her sheet, then claim Inspiration when doing the eyeball-licking thing (once per session). Then state a poor approach to the goal of trying to deceive an NPC e.g. "I get very nervous and spin a fantastical yarn in a poor attempt to lie to [NPC] while frantically licking my own eyeball." Then I can just say the character fails to deceive the NPC and the player walks away with Inspiration for use later.

Not every attempt at deception is a Deception check. There are no checks unless there's an uncertain outcome and a meaningful consequence of failure, all of which is determined by the DM. Sometimes it just succeeds or fails outright, no roll.

 

[Reynard]

If it is your character's flaw, then engaging it when it matters and is dramatically appropriate should net you inspiration. Otherwise it should be up to the DM to decide when and if it causes disadvantage. Just roleplay it up and let the person behind the screen figure out the rest.

 

[MechaPilot]

So I'm curious. Would any DM's here allow a player to choose or request to have disadvantage on a roll they normally wouldn't have disadvantage on?

Reason I'm asking is because I'm about to play a Kobold character that is a horrible liar. He gets visibly nervous and starts licking his eye (as reptiles do). I feel like anytime he would attempt deception rolls, he would be at disadvantage. But he doesn't have any mechanical reason for constant disadvantage. And this isn't a matter where I'm asking for any kind of compensating mechanical benefit (like advantage on insight checks). I'm not looking for anything like that.

And this got me thinking, in general how would you handle this at your table? Would you allow a player to request disadvantage?

"Poor liar" sounds like a perfectly acceptable character flaw to me. I'd allow it. I would offer the player a compensating advantage, but if they really didn't want to take one I wouldn't force one on them.

 

[Grognerd]

Absolutely my group would allow it. If there was a DM who refused to let a player be disadvantaged when said player was specifically requesting it for role-playing purposes, I’d be looking for a DM on less of a power trip. So yes, I’d allow it, and would hate to be that power hungry when I was DMing.

 

[Charlaquin]

Players describe what they want to do, which doesn't include making an ability check or requesting advantage or disadvantage. So this would not fly at my table. I would recommend to the player that he or she should write the flaw "I have a 'tell' that reveals I'm lying" on his or her sheet, then claim Inspiration when doing the eyeball-licking thing (once per session). Then state a poor approach to the goal of trying to deceive an NPC e.g. "I get very nervous and spin a fantastical yarn in a poor attempt to lie to [NPC] while frantically licking my own eyeball." Then I can just say the character fails to deceive the NPC and the player walks away with Inspiration for use later.

Not every attempt at deception is a Deception check. There are no checks unless there's an uncertain outcome and a meaningful consequence of failure, all of which is determined by the DM. Sometimes it just succeeds or fails outright, no roll.

Very well said.

“My character is bad at lying and has disadvantage on Deception checks” assumes that a Deception check needs to be made in the first place, which it may well not depending on your goal and approach. That’s for the DM to decide. If you were at my table, I would say just write your tell down as your flaw, and when you attempt to lie, remind me that your character is licking their eyeballs. I’ll determine if you need to make a check at all, and whether or not it has disadvantage if you do, but either way you’ll get inspiration for bringing your flaw into play.

To clarify, if we were in a situation where you had already described your attempt to deceive an NPC and I had asked for a check, and you said “should it have disadvantage because of my tell?” I would say either “yes,” “no,” or “in that case, he can definitely tell you’re lying, no check required.” And I would allow that even if it wasn’t your flaw, you just wouldn’t get inspiration for it if it wasn’t.

 

[ccs]

Sure. I'll always let you choose to penalize yourself.

True, I decide if a check is needed in the 1st place. But if you want negatives? Ok.

The reverse does not apply. Only I decide if bonuses apply.

 

[TwoSix]

Sure, why not? Choosing to reinforce a character's image by choosing suboptimal mechanical expressions of those characteristics is a long, honored tradition. Think of people spending skill points on Profession(farmer) back in the day.