WIR S1 Tomb of Horrors [SPOILERS!! SPOILERS EVERYWHERE!!]‏

[jonesy]

Do they get to keep their clothes/equipment?

I think they do in the blue one, since it's only mentioned on the green one. But I'll get back to that once the thread reaches the place it takes them to. I have major problems with it.

Questions:Are the PCs still floating after they teleport out of the pillared throne room? The text doesn’t say one way or another.

I always assumed they'd stop floating. It says it spits them out. If they were floating, they might end up dying of hunger up in the ceiling (without remove curse or dispel magic). Also, the description of the blue teleport location seems to think otherwise. Maybe. But more on that later too.

 

[Stoat]

@ Bullgrit. The module is not perfectly clear, but I assume that PC's who go through the bluish devil face keep their gear because the text doesn't say otherwise. Generally, the module is pretty explicit when the PC's go one way and their gear goes another.

I'm of two minds about the countdowns. On the one hand, they immediately grab everybody's attention and force the players to stop fafffing around making Monty Python jokes and do something. They also inject a nice dose of tension into the game.

On the other hand, the countdown is a very, very gamey mechanic. If immersion or verisimilitude are your goals, you won't like it. I also tend to think that countdowns can be too suggestive. In other words, as soon as the players hear the DM counting, they know trouble is afoot. An element of surprise is lost. Finally, countdowns present some logistical difficulty. IME the players start asking questions and declaring actions as soon as the DM starts counting. It's a little tricky to keep counting while also adjudicating PC actions that would only take a few seconds of real time.

 

[Bullgrit]

Another thing to consider:

The assumption seems to be that the gem will be wished upon and the explosion triggered right there in the pillared chamber. But there is nothing preventing the PCs from pocketing the wish gem, (like they would a ring of wishes), and the whole event happening outside the Tomb at some far later date.

In the hands of careful and devious PCs, the wish gem could be an awesome one-shot weapon.

Bullgrit

 

[jonesy]

In the hands of careful and devious PCs, the wish gem could be an awesome one-shot weapon.

Or turn a later more innocent adventure into a TPK.

 

[Rogue Agent]

On the other hand, the countdown is a very, very gamey mechanic. If immersion or verisimilitude are your goals, you won't like it.

Speaking as someone who likes immersion and versimilitude a lot, I'd disagree. If anything I think it heightens immersion by eradicating the normally lethargic and disconnected mode of interacting with mechanics (in which a 10 second combat round could take 10 minutes to resolve) and forces a real-time response.

I also tend to think that countdowns can be too suggestive. In other words, as soon as the players hear the DM counting, they know trouble is afoot.

In general, I think the countdowns in the Tomb follow clear signs that trouble is afoot: The rumbling starts in area 2. The floor begins to slant in area 16. The imminent (albeit illusory) collapse in area 18. The pulsing light of the gem.

Area 18 is particularly notable because it is a fake alarm: If the DM reaches the end of the count and the PCs haven't done anything, there is no consequence.

IME the players start asking questions and declaring actions as soon as the DM starts counting. It's a little tricky to keep counting while also adjudicating PC actions that would only take a few seconds of real time.

The module tells you how to handle that: You resolve the actions after you finish counting.

I recommend prepping a "countdown sheet" with the numbers 1 thru 10 down one side. As you start counting have a pencil in hand; jot down names next to the numbers as people shout out their intentions.

The only action that matters in all of these cases is movement: If the PCs do anything other than movement, they may succeed but it will probably not have any impact on the outcome. (It's not that different from adjudicating actions in a system that requires action declaration at the beginning of each round. You're just ramping up the tension during the declaration phase and tweaking the resolution based on the quickness of response.)

The only adjustment I've made in practice is that I will answer observational questions while continuing the count. Thus:

DM: There's a deep rumble. Everything starts shaking. 10...9...
Wizard: What's happening?!
DM: The wall behind you is sliding shut. 8...
Fighter: ! I start running for the exit!
DM: 7...
Wizard: Does it look like it's going to close all the way?
DM: Probably. 6...
Wizard: I run! I run!

And so forth.

This is another example of where I feel the module does a good job of introducing its conventions and then sticking to them. It introduces the concept of the countdown and then plays around with it to good effect.

 

[jmucchiello]

Page 6: "NOW BEGIN COUNTING SLOWLY TO 10, and the odds on that there will be a stampede up the stairs to get away."

It seems to be fairly explicit that these counts are supposed to be out loud.

Perhaps I'm thinking of a different module of the era.

 

[Gentlegamer]

And here at last we get to the moment of shame. And thanks by the way for rubbing it in like that.

The second party I played the Tomb in entered area 25 with five PC's (a ranger, a druid, a thief, a mage, and me with a fighter). We'd already lost a donkey, three NPC hirelings, a PC cleric, and the other PC fighter.

What happened next went something like this:
1. The ranger, being the party leader and the most experienced player, decides that we head to A (the green devil teleporter) and get prepared to enter the 26 room next to it (since there are two rooms designated 26).
2. The ranger says: "We start tying ropes across the pillars in front of the door " (the door to 26).
3. The DM says: "All of you help him?"
4. Everyone looks at the player of the ranger and then nods. The first dumb thing has just occurred.
5. The DM says: "As you touch the pillars.."
6. A simultaneous groan escapes from every player.
7. The DM continues describing what happens as we all float right into A, and get sucked in. As we were all already right next to it there was no time really do anything. The DM decreed that we hadn't even managed to get a single rope set up, since we'd had to touch the pillars to do that.
8. We plop out in front of area 6.
9. The most amazingly stupid thing occurs. We decide, as one, to jump right 'back' in, with the idea that it would take us back to the room and our equipment. It seemed perfectly logical at the time.
10. 5 dead PC's.
11. Stunned silence. Then someone, I can't remember who, makes the comment: "And I used to think that the Head of Vecna story was stupid".

A TPK. You lost. And yet, you remember this episode so distinctly.

As I've said, sometimes the most fun you have is when you lose. I think Tomb of Horrors ought to be evaluated with this in mind.

 

[Rogue Agent]

As I've said, sometimes the most fun you have is when you lose. I think Tomb of Horrors ought to be evaluated with this in mind.

This is something I suspect is often lost in an era when a TPK can "ruin" a GM's prepared plot.

 

[Hussar]

Yes, because back in the day, games had no plots or stories, just a series of random events loosely bound together by character...

 

[Ranes]

This is something I suspect is often lost in an era when a TPK can "ruin" a GM's prepared plot.

There's a thread in the 4e form at the moment about TPKs that you may find interesting.

That TPKs can render GM preparations, plot, campaign backgrounds, whatever redundant is nothing new. But that is in itself no reason to avoid them, as Gentlegamer points out.