wizard of the spiraling out of control

[unan oranis]

A wizard takes the feats to get two implement mastery's (staff and orb), proficiency with light shields and longsword. As a wizard of the spiral tower, he chooses staff as the implement that his longsword can emulate.

So this wizard can now enter battle with sword and shield, holding the orb in his off hand, and gaining the defensive powers of the staff implement and the light shield... (I assume)

could he use the orb as an implement to make attacks, and/or use its daily power?

supposing he hits with both attacks "the one sword" provides,

Encounter - Arcane, Weapon
Standard Action Melee weapon
Target: One creature
Attack: Intelligence vs. Reflex
Hit: 2[W] + Intelligence modifier damage. Make a secondary
attack against the target.
Secondary Attack: Intelligence vs. Will
Hit: The target is dazed until the end of your next turn,
and this power is not expended.


and his orb is an orb of inevitable continuance,

Power (Daily): Minor Action. One of your powers that is due
to end at the end of this turn instead lasts until the end of
your next turn.


Can he extend the duration of the effect via the daily power, and/or can he use his orb mastery ability? Or would he have to drop the light shield or in some way wield the orb in his off hand "completely" by sheathing his sword and passing the orb over or some such?

Should he extend the duration, would "the one sword" still be expended if he uses it on someone else and misses, or would the extension also prevent the power from being expended? I'm guessing no, but hoping someone can tell me yes.

 

[James McMurray]

So this wizard can now enter battle with sword and shield, holding the orb in his off hand, and gaining the defensive powers of the staff implement and the light shield... (I assume)

As long as he has shield proficiency he's cool.

could he use the orb as an implement to make attacks, and/or use its daily power?

Yep.

supposing he hits with both attacks "the one sword" provides,

and his orb is an orb of inevitable continuance,

Can he extend the duration of the effect via the daily power, and/or can he use his orb mastery ability?

He can use the daily, but orb mastery only applies to At Will powers.

Should he extend the duration, would "the one sword" still be expended if he uses it on someone else and misses, or would the extension also prevent the power from being expended? I'm guessing no, but hoping someone can tell me yes.

The only thing that stops it from being expended is if the secondary attack hits. It doesn't matter what happened on any previous uses of the power, or if they're still in effect.

 

[ForbidenMaster]

3. If you wield a light shield, you can also hold an item as well, although you can’t attack with it. What if that item is an implement? Can you apply its implement bonus to your powers?

No. Using an implement to gain its bonuses is considered attacking with that implement. If you wield a light shield and hold an implement in the same hand, you would not get the implement enhancement bonus to your powers, but you would still benefit from any property that the implement has.

Answer

 

[MadLordOfMilk]

He can use the daily, but orb mastery only applies to At Will powers.

Sort of. The saving throw mod can apply to anything, but you can only extend at-wills if you choose that option when you use your orb mastery.

Now, Wizard of the Spiral Tower. Check the wording on Corellon's Implement: "You can use a longsword as if it were that type of arcane implement when casting your spells." It seems to imply you would not get the passive +1 AC bonus from staff mastery, but you certainly still could use the encounter ability.

Shield-wise, as far as using a second implement.... Quick Draw? I mean, you only need to pull it out for orb mastery once per encounter. Sheathing the sword would take a minor then quick draw would allow you to use the implement, right?

 

[ShaggySpellsword]

Shield-wise, as far as using a second implement.... Quick Draw? I mean, you only need to pull it out for orb mastery once per encounter. Sheathing the sword would take a minor then quick draw would allow you to use the implement, right?

Why Quick Draw when you could just use Mage Hand to simultaneously put an object in your hand in your pouch and a new object in your hand as a minor action?

 

[MyISPHatesENWorld]

Now, Wizard of the Spiral Tower. Check the wording on Corellon's Implement: "You can use a longsword as if it were that type of arcane implement when casting your spells." It seems to imply you would not get the passive +1 AC bonus from staff mastery, but you certainly still could use the encounter ability.

It in no way implies you wouldn't get that one ability. You can use the longsword as if it were the staff implement. You get both abilities.

 

[deadsmurf]

In my game a player would get either sword + staff + shield abilities. or Orb + shield abilities. If they try to use staff + orb abilities at the same time neither work, and an orb can't be held in the same hand as a shield to be 'wielded' properly. The sword or orb would have to be stowed for the other to be used. I do like the suggested creative use of mage hand to hold the unused implement though, that I would allow.

 

[MyISPHatesENWorld]

In my game a player would get either sword + staff + shield abilities. or Orb + shield abilities. If they try to use staff + orb abilities at the same time neither work, and an orb can't be held in the same hand as a shield to be 'wielded' properly. The sword or orb would have to be stowed for the other to be used. I do like the suggested creative use of mage hand to hold the unused implement though, that I would allow.

THat's fine as your personal house rule. I wouldn't play with that rule though.

 

[rjdafoe]

THat's fine as your personal house rule. I wouldn't play with that rule though.

That is interesting. Which part of the rule? That both implements don't work or that you can't wield an orb and a shield in the same arm/hand?

I know there is not technically an orb slot, but if you look at the hand slot items, none of them would impede using a shield in the same hand such as grasping an orb would.

So while the rules probably do not say anything like this, I am not sure they have to.

 

[MyISPHatesENWorld]

That is interesting. Which part of the rule? That both implements don't work or that you can't wield an orb and a shield in the same arm/hand?

Both.

You can wield two implements at the same time, you just can't attack with both at the same time. The benefits of the implement mastery features aren't attacks. They are passive (+1 AC), Immediate Interrupt (bonus to defense equal to CON bonus), and Free Actions (assign a penalty to saves to a creature which you have already affected by a spell that a save ends equal to WIS bonus, extention of duration on an existing effect that would end at the end of your current turn to end of your next turn, bonus to an attack roll equal to DEX bonus which can be applied after you know the result of a roll).

You must be wielding the implement to perform those actions or gain the passive benefit. Nothing prohibits you from wielding the implement to perform those actions or gain the passive benefit while wielding another implement in the other hand.

I know there is not technically an orb slot, but if you look at the hand slot items, none of them would impede using a shield in the same hand such as grasping an orb would.

I'm not sure what point you're making with hand slot items. You can't use both a magic shield and another arm slot magic item. You can use a hand slot magic item and a magic shield. No rule exists that would prohibit you from holding an orb in your shield hand. As magic orbs don't use either arm slots or hand slots. It seems wholly irrelevant within the context of the rules.

So while the rules probably do not say anything like this, I am not sure they have to.

The issue of holding an orb or other implement in the hand of your shield arm has been addressed officially, FAQ answer #3, previously quoted in this thread, so the rules do mention something like this.

"3. If you wield a light shield, you can also hold an item as well, although you can’t attack with it. What if that item is an implement? Can you apply its implement bonus to your powers?

No. Using an implement to gain its bonuses is considered attacking with that implement. If you wield a light shield and hold an implement in the same hand, you would not get the implement enhancement bonus to your powers, but you would still benefit from any property that the implement has."

Nothing there (or elsewhere that I am aware of) officially states that you can't use the implement held in your shield hand for things other than attacking.