Wizards in a rough patch?

[Dragonblade]

This, however, is somewhat new to Wizards and I must say, there recent adventurous forays are NOT doing it for me. Heroes of Battle and Weapons of Legacy got left on the shelf by me. And Magic of Incarnum has me very skeptical. But the titles a little futher in the future are looking promising. Is it just a learning process?

Hmm, I felt that Heroes of Battle was excellent. One of the better WotC books. So was DMG 2.

 

[DaveMage]

I'm pleased with WotC latest offerings.

I do have some issues with weapons of legacy, but all of those issues disappear if I remove the non-gold costs of having a weapon of legacy.

Granted, some books I'll probably never use (Heroes of Battle), but overall, I'm pretty happy.

I like the environments series, and the monster series (Lords of Madness, Libris Mortis), I was a bit disappointed with Waterdeep (seemed a bit too small), but since I have all the 2E Waterdeep supplements, I can fill in the blanks with those.

I'm looking forward to Magic of Incarnum, and the minis sets seem to be as good as ever.

 

[twofalls]

Most everything posted on these boards is personal opinion. This book is great, that book sucks, Wizards product line is getting weaker, stronger, holding its own... It's opinions that make the boards intesting to read. That being said, it's quite funny to see folks take their opinons and state them as facts. I'm not pointing a finger at anyone here or there mind you, but I've read a number of threads that definitivly state that Wizards books are dropping in quality.

I love Draconomicron and Lords of Madness, and thought that Libris Mortis rated just above toilet tissue. There are lots of folks who love Libris Mortis... Weapons of Legacy takes the idea from Earthdawn (and maybe some other games I'm not familiar with) and makes them into character and story enhancements. I thought it was a great idea. The fact remains that a game company that wants to please and maintain a wide customer base is going to produce products that apeal to some and don't appeal to others.

What I'd like to know is where this obsessive idea that people should "like" everything a publisher produces and buy it all, or otherwise the company is doing a poor job comes from? Just seems silly to me.

 

[devilbat]

I too have enjoyed the Monster series and the enviroment series. Heck, the enviroment series are some of the better gaming materials I've seen in a while. I enjoy 90% of the Forgotten Realms releases, and people are still raving about Eberron, although I can't comment, as I have no interest in the setting.

I think Wizards is doing a fine job, and cudos to them for trying something new with Weapons of Legacy and Magic Incarnum. You gotta break some eggs to make an omelet.

 

[DragonLancer]

This, however, is somewhat new to Wizards and I must say, there recent adventurous forays are NOT doing it for me. Heroes of Battle and Weapons of Legacy got left on the shelf by me. And Magic of Incarnum has me very skeptical. But the titles a little futher in the future are looking promising. Is it just a learning process?

I don't think WotC are going through a rough patch. I figure they are experimenting with new directions to see how they work out.

For me the majority of recent Wizards material has been sub-par or just not what I want.

DMG, Weapons of Legacy and Magic of Incarnum are just don't interest me. While Heroes of Battle was (IMO) awful and could have been a damn sight better.

But saying that, the recent environment books (Sandstorm & Stormwrack), and Lords of Madness have been some of their best books for a good while.

These days I think gamers pretty much have the books they want in their collection, and so it takes a different approach to see how things work and if these new ideas will make money.

 

[Psion]

But saying that, the recent environment books (Sandstorm & Stormwrack), and Lords of Madness have been some of their best books for a good while.

I didn enjoy Stormwrack (not dazzling, but solid and useful) and Lords of Madness, as well as DMG II. Those aren't the subset of books that aren't doing it for me.

 

[Mystery Man]

Does anyone else feel this way?

This, however, is somewhat new to Wizards and I must say, there recent adventurous forays are NOT doing it for me. Heroes of Battle and Weapons of Legacy got left on the shelf by me. And Magic of Incarnum has me very skeptical. But the titles a little futher in the future are looking promising. Is it just a learning process?

Are basing the success of their business on what you personally like? We can argue subjectivity all day if you want.

I liked Heroes of Battle and haven't got Weapons of Legacy but probably will. I won't be getting Magic of Incarnum. Heroes of Horror looks pretty cool.

I think they need to chuck this whole "Fantastic Locations" thing they have going. It's dumb.

so where does that leave us>? I have no clue.

 

[Jer]

Does anyone else feel this way?

It seems to me as if Wizards has made it their primary business of handling the classic topics, while third party publishers have had to seek out more esoteric subjects. Some of those third party publishers really had a rough go of it (some aren't around anymore), but the survivors seem to have plumbed out the depths of the fringe territory and are churning out some pretty good stuff.

This, however, is somewhat new to Wizards and I must say, there recent adventurous forays are NOT doing it for me. Heroes of Battle and Weapons of Legacy got left on the shelf by me. And Magic of Incarnum has me very skeptical. But the titles a little futher in the future are looking promising. Is it just a learning process?

Its the cycle. Wizards is now in the "mature" part of the product cycle and they're looking for stuff to keep the game fresh. When the game was "new" and fresh, they could publish the "core" stuff - like class books, race books, and reworkings of classic 1st edition stuff (Manual of the Planes, Oriental Adventures, etc.)

Now, though, they have to come up with new stuff to sell books. That's just how it goes. They're branching into new areas (for them) and its going to be much more likely that there will be misses with products than there were in the earlier days - they're feeling their way around and trying to guess what the public will like. Even with polling and focus groups there's no real way to "know" what's going to sell until you make it and get it on the shelves and see who bites.

When TSR hit the "maturity" problem with 2nd edition, their answer was to start pumping out new campaign worlds. A mature 2nd edition saw the introduction of Ravenloft, Spelljammer, Dark Sun, Birthright and Planescape. Because WotC has the view that TSR split their own market by making so many campaign settings, Wizards has decided to not go the multiple campaign worlds option - choosing to focus on two worlds instead and to try to make most of their products useful for "generic" campaigns.

As Wizards makes new supplements now, I imagine they will be more "hit and miss" than prior supplements were for most people. They're going to be less "core" and more "niche" so they're going to be perceived as less useful overall. On the other hand, there's a better chance that we can get the next revolutionary idea out of something like this than the core material revamps that they've spent much of the last 5+ years doing.

 

[Krug]

I think their miniatures have been quite a decent success. So doubt if it's that much of a rough patch.

 

[DragonLancer]

I didn enjoy Stormwrack (not dazzling, but solid and useful) and Lords of Madness, as well as DMG II. Those aren't the subset of books that aren't doing it for me.

Heh. We have opposite tastes it would appear.
Thankfully I work part-time in my FLGS so I get to read the new products when they come in before I even consider buying them. DMG2 seemed like a real waste of time to me, though I've seen plenty of threads across the net where DMs made good use of it.

As for Stormwrack, its the weakest of the three current environment series but still handy in my eyes.

I think I'm in that faction of gamers who have pretty much what they want, and/or have bought product before and had it just sit on the shelf gathering dust. I'm a lot more picky these days.