World Serpent's Grasp & Headsman's Chop

[Cardinair]

This came up in my game the other night. I was wondering if you guys could shed some light on the situation. It's about a combo of feats our party's fighter has:

-World Serpent's Grasp: Whenever you hit a slowed or immobilized target with an attack, you can knock it prone.

-Headsman's Chop: Whenever you hit a prone target with an axe or heavy blade, the target takes 5 extra damage.


The fighter hit a slowed monster with his axe. He reasoned that World Serpent's Grasp specifically states that it triggers whenever you hit a monster, that meant it would be knocked prone before he had to make a damage roll. Thus, Headsman's Chop would trigger as well because the damage was being dealt to a prone target.

We argued about it for a few minutes until the DM decided World Serpent's Grasp triggers after the damage has already been done, so Headsman's Chop would not apply during the same round.

What do you guys think?

 

[the Jester]

When you hit, the target is not prone.

The dm was right; the player was reaching, and not too unreasonably. But unfortunately for him, both effects resolve at the same time ("when you hit").

 

[Scrivener of Doom]

I agree with [MENTION=1210]the Jester[/MENTION].

 

[Ferghis]

The outcome is correct. The requirements for each is checked for at the moment the target is hit. Was it slowed? Apparently. Was it prone? Not until after it was hit. So no Headsman's chop damage.

 

[Wednesday Boy]

I concur with the GM, the Jester, Scrivener of Doom, and Ferghis.

 

[Istar]

Why were you wasting game time arguing with him ?

Just make a ruling on the spot, and say you will confirm it one way or the other before the next game.

You are the DM remember.

 

[Wednesday Boy]

Why were you wasting game time arguing with him ?

Just make a ruling on the spot, and say you will confirm it one way or the other before the next game.

You are the DM remember.

I think the OP is a player, not the GM. But otherwise I agree that this the best way to handle rules questions.

 

[Nikosandros]

I believe that all the previous posters are correct, but I also think that 4e would greatly benefit from a thorough discussion of timing issues. Couldn't they ask for some advice from the MtG team?