Worlds of Design: The Price of Advancement

In AD&D, there was a training requirement to advancement that didn’t reflect how people actually learn. In this column I’ll talk about how the real world works in this context.
In AD&D, there was a training requirement to advancement that didn’t reflect how people actually learn. In this column I’ll talk about how the real world works in this context.

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Picture courtesy of Pixabay.
“I am always doing that which I cannot do, in order that I may learn how to do it.” ― Pablo Picasso

To Train or Not to Train?​

One of the more notable abandoned rules in RPGs is the training requirement, originally of AD&D:
AD&D introduced detailed training rules in the Dungeon Masters Guide (1e) (1979), p.86. The full rules occupy almost a full page and involve multiple formulae to calculate the exact amount of time and money the character must spend to level up, based on several factors including character level, class, the DM's judgement of how well the player acted in keeping with their character class and alignment, whether or not a tutor is available. The character must spend 1,500 gold pieces times their current character level per week, with high level characters spending from 1,000gp/level to 4,000gp/level depending on class. A character who qualifies for a level cannot gain any XP until they have gained a level.
It doesn’t reflect at all how people actually learn something like adventuring, and turns adventurers into mere money-grubbers. Moreover, it failed from a game design point of view. It disappeared from later editions of the game.

In the rough and tumble world of adventuring, few characters are scholastically trained. Originally, bards attended bardic colleges. It was always implied that wizards learn their spells through some form of formal education, separate and distinct from the later sorcerer and warlock who received their magic from other sources. And although clerics are presumably a member of a religion, education is oddly separate from it (perhaps to further distinguish wizards from clerics), even though religious institutions were traditionally a place of higher learning.

Add all this up, and it’s more likely that heroes advance through real life experience than reading about it at a desk.

How Realistic is It?​

As a retired college and graduate school teacher I recognize that a good teacher can convey their experience to enable someone to avoid the lessons of the “school of hard knocks.” I also recognize that it’s possible for someone to do something over and over but to do it poorly in a way that does not lead to improvement—though if you did that as an adventurer, you’d soon be dead. Despite that, once they start working, most people who are good at practical disciplines become better primarily through experience, not training.

Computer role-playing games approach training differently. A column in PC Gamer magazine written years ago expressed a preference for computer-platform RPG skill-based development systems in which players improve in the capabilities that they use, rather than allocate experience points to whatever improvements they choose. It made much more sense that you improve in the things you actually do than those you train for.

This approach is a rejection of Dungeons & Dragons’ leveling up, in which characters hit a plateau before advancing all their abilities at once. It’s a compromise between having “grades” of advancement, much like higher education, and collecting real life experience that gets you there. No wonder games set in modern times traditionally discard level-based advancement for skill development systems.

Schooling or Experience?​

In today's world, schooling is often a substitute for experience, and a way to acquire knowledge when someone wants to enter a discipline but knows little about it. But it's just the start of a career in that field, a minor component for actual practitioners who want to become better at their discipline.

It is not an uncommon assumption that formal training is the only way to learn a craft or trade. Not surprisingly, this is propagated by institutions responsible for that form of training. Certifications and licenses help regulate an industry and bolster confidence in customers who might hire someone in a skill. Some disciplines require a lot of education before you can gain experience by doing. Law, History, and other academic disciplines come to mind.

But adventurers don’t often live in such a formal world; more likely, they learn by doing. In some cases, what they do is unique enough that there are no teachers; in others, it’s dangerous enough that few people survive long enough to teach others.

We can find “untrained” people in many disciplines who excel in spite of their lack of formal education–for example, Hans Zimmer is one of the great composers of our time and completely self-taught. Game design itself is one of those fields: GMing is a discipline where we learn from experience, either as player or as GM. I certainly never had the opportunity to take any game design classes, but I do pretty well at it and know enough about it to write a well-received book on the subject (which I finished in 2011; I know a lot more now).

Training certainly has its place in games, particularly in large institutions in which navigating the rules is as much as an adventure as fighting monsters. But D&D has traditionally been less about large institutions, who lurk in the background, and more about personal advancement and experience. Forcing training on characters feels artificial because it means heroes need to be certified and licensed to do what they do best. No wonder later editions of D&D minimized training requirements for advancement. We'll discuss what replaced the AD&D system in the next article.

Your Turn: How do you handle training in your games?
 

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Lewis Pulsipher

Lewis Pulsipher

Dragon, White Dwarf, Fiend Folio

werecorpse

Adventurer
Special Forces train all the time. Medieval Knights trained all the time. I'm not saying 1e rules for training make sense, but training and practice are important for improvement and to stay sharp.
Do/Did they train in skills (apart from working on a specific plan or team coordination, or maybe learning how a new tool works) when they are actually also doing the job?

I see that professional sports people who tend to have part of the year not playing games spend that time either in recovery post season, relaxing off season or training in pre season. During the season while they do training it seems to be more recovery sessions and maybe team coordination (learning set plays). So I mostly agree with the OP.

Im not really a fan of the Traveller rpg base system that you can only improve skills via training not through use.

It seems to me that you that training matters but in game you can justify training requirement as best fits for your world/campaign view.

The training requirement in AD&D 1e seemed mostly to serve the purpose of draining excess cash from PC’s. I think you can legitimately discard the training requirement should you so choose using the “we learn by doing” argument or use a training requirement differently. I use it to make characters want a bit of downtime, to draw players attention to parts of the in game world that aren’t adventures, and to imply that high level people have taken at least some not insubstantial time working to get there.

My homebrew in campaign nod to training in 5e is to say that to level up at each odd level (not even as the odd levels tend to have the greater character ability bumps) you need to have undertaken a certain amount of training (5 days for levels 3,5,; 10 for 7,9; 15 for levels 11,13; 20 for levels 15,17, 25 for level 19) as well as have the xp and take a long rest (which is all you require at even levels). The characters can pick up the training at any time during their time at the lower level, it’s relatively inexpensive (5gp a day for 3&5 doubling at 7,11,15,19) & doesn’t require a mentor of higher level just someone or place that can act as a teacher or place where you can get training or knowledge (Ie a temple for religious types, a library or a retired warrior).

So the characters upon reaching 9th level and being in a city know to start looking around during downtime to start getting some training. While one is spending a week recovering from a lingering injury and another is spending a couple of days writing out spells into their spellbook then making a scroll, the rest go do stuff to pick up 7 of the 15 days of training they need to get to 11th level and note it down. I’ve only once had a character not have done the training before they got the xp to level up and I think that was in part because they were new to this system and in part because the party got a lot of xp quite quickly.
 

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Thomas Shey

Legend
There's an argument that certain very high levels of skill have some overhead on keeping them from eroding that translates into training. Its highly debatable that that indicates its necessary so much as needed when you're not going to be using them constantly (and of course a good part of the special forces and pro sports examples is as much or more about maintaining the extremely high level of physical fitness in terms of strength and endurance, where this is even more true than with skills).
 


In AD&D, there was a training requirement to advancement that didn’t reflect how people actually learn.

It was more reflecting an academic learning where students spend a semester getting formal education (ding, level) then get sent a semester in internship to put their skills to use and hone them before getting back next year for the next teaching session. Which is a great model for some classes (Students, we have now covered the basics of fireball and fly. From January to May, you'll be required to kill a troll and three harpies as part of your curriculum. Next year, with the survivors among you, we'll start with Advanced Transmutation and the Polymorph spell...) Or for martial artists when you've been taught and can perform satisfying katas but need to get some actual experience to complete it and get your belt (but then, it's often not that separated). I wouldn't discard that as "not reflecting how people actually learn". It's not a great model for how adventurer would like to learn, though, as they are already supposed to be masters of their skills from the get go in 5e. Tier 1 is "local heroes" not "peasant who just picked up a sword". The money part was the oddest (but maybe it was because the game designer was from a country where educational costs are supported by the student?) because it imply a model of relationship between trainee and teacher that should be world-dependant. At some level, I can't imagine a 16th level hero sending 3,000 gp to a 18th level peer to get a quick Planeshift primer or how to get the basic on the breathing exercices that makes one ageless. They'd trade in favour instead, and it would be much more interesting.

Add all this up, and it’s more likely that heroes advance through real life experience than reading about it at a desk.

True, they get better with experience... but experience helps you doing thing you know how to do better. If you're a trained swimmer, the key to the Olympics is to swim a lot. And do exercices that will make you a better swimmer. On the other hand, no olympic swimmer has started with experience, being thrown in the middle of the lake and told to practice swimming toward the shore by people in a little boat. Unless you consider abilities gained as level up as rediscovered by the character each time, they don't sound to me extension of something the character already knew, outside of proficiency bonus improving. Let's take an exemple with the Fighter class, one that is joined when you failed to enter Wizard college. Sure, you can "dress" Action surge as becoming faster because your training make you better at doing fighting moves. But suddenly, at 3rd level, you get your martial archetype. If you've been killing people with arrows for 2 levels, suddenly, one of your arrow can displace someone to the feywild or explode on impact. Do you think it's the natural result of training with arrows or a "trick" someone might give a few hints about with the rest of the mastery coming from practice? Even if Arcane Archer was the worst choice, Echo Knight (suddenly, bashing people with a mace makes a fantomatic double of you appear), Banneret (people wounds disappear as you encourage them... that's something every orator in the world through talking and why political speech are prescribed alongside vitamins by doctors?), the cavalier who never had seen a horse become a master horseman, and so on. Outside of the champion who doubles his critical range and just become "better at doing things he did before", most of the abilities involve getting something new that doesn't immediately flow from already known abilities. They might not learn "at a desk" but I don't think AD&D explicitely described the training as "sitting in a classroom". Training to learn how to ride, and do so effectively in battle, is certainly easier at an equitation school than by seeing a horse in the wild and saying suddenly "I'll jump on one and learn how to control it..."

How Realistic is It?​

As a retired college and graduate school teacher I recognize that a good teacher can convey their experience to enable someone to avoid the lessons of the “school of hard knocks.” I also recognize that it’s possible for someone to do something over and over but to do it poorly in a way that does not lead to improvement—though if you did that as an adventurer, you’d soon be dead. Despite that, once they start working, most people who are good at practical disciplines become better primarily through experience, not training.
True. Once they start working. Which means that they already got the basic skills they need to function in their job. However, levels in current D&D don't involve just improving at things you know, but getting new abilities. If you're a modern car mechanics, you can become a better car mechanics by repairing cars all your life... but at no point will you sprout the ability to be a modern aircraft mechanics which is more in line with what D&D leveling is about.

This is compounded by the fact that leveling can be in a entire new class or, since it's D&D general, a prestige class.


Computer role-playing games approach training differently. A column in PC Gamer magazine written years ago expressed a preference for computer-platform RPG skill-based development systems in which players improve in the capabilities that they use, rather than allocate experience points to whatever improvements they choose. It made much more sense that you improve in the things you actually do than those you train for.

This approach is a rejection of Dungeons & Dragons’ leveling up, in which characters hit a plateau before advancing all their abilities at once. It’s a compromise between having “grades” of advancement, much like higher education, and collecting real life experience that gets you there. No wonder games set in modern times traditionally discard level-based advancement for skill development systems.

I am surprised by this last statement. Why would skill development be more fitting for "games set in modern times"? Also, Runequest and d100 systems: the rejection dates from the early eighties and was initialy designed for medieval fantasy.

But adventurers don’t often live in such a formal world; more likely, they learn by doing. In some cases, what they do is unique enough that there are no teachers; in others, it’s dangerous enough that few people survive long enough to teach others.

If what they do is unique so there is no teacher, I wouldn't call that learning but researching. The two spells per level that wizards gain are supposed to reflect off-stage independant research by the wizard, so they can get spells at high levels. But for the more common, low-to-mid level spells, it's much easier to just learn them from a scroll overnight rather than developping the technique by yourself and independant research. Battle Master get a proficiency with a tool: did they really invent mapmaking or glassblowing independantly? If so, why did they spend so much time instead of learning it with a master? The "uniqueness" of abilities can explain high level development, at levels... apparently nobody plays if we're to trust Enworld's common knowledge about that.


We can find “untrained” people in many disciplines who excel in spite of their lack of formal education–for example, Hans Zimmer is one of the great composers of our time and completely self-taught.

There is a little exaggeration going in this article. While he's extremely self-taught, the Wikipedia article about him has a quote of him:

Wikipedia said:
My formal training was two weeks of piano lessons. I was thrown out of eight schools. But I joined a band. I am self-taught. But I've always heard music in my head.

Unless he managed to be thrown of piano schools before less than two days has passed in each, there might be some more formal training than assumed. Also, he joined "bands" (several of them) and it's entirely possible he got to learn a few things by companionship with more experienced band members, which is a form of "training" in the D&D sense.

Also, while he's one of the great composer of our time, he's still level 1. Apollo and Marsyas are able to make tree weeps with their music, something that Hans Zimmer has yet to achieve. Also, while is musing is elative and inspiring to great heights, he can't get a flight speed out of it. He's just... naturally gifted (high relevant stat), with expertise in the composing tools as his free 1st level feat.

Game design itself is one of those fields: GMing is a discipline where we learn from experience, either as player or as GM. I certainly never had the opportunity to take any game design classes, but I do pretty well at it and know enough about it to write a well-received book on the subject (which I finished in 2011; I know a lot more now).

And that book seeks to make other become a better GM, doesn't it? So by spending some downtime and spending gp on the book, I can improve my GM level? Sure, you indeed demonstrated that GM is learnt from experience there...

Training certainly has its place in games, particularly in large institutions in which navigating the rules is as much as an adventure as fighting monsters. But D&D has traditionally been less about large institutions, who lurk in the background, and more about personal advancement and experience. Forcing training on characters feels artificial because it means heroes need to be certified and licensed to do what they do best.

Err... Eberron?


Your Turn: How do you handle training in your games?

I assume the character train all the time when offscreen. For most of them, it's a matter of survival, given their field of work. It may include downtime learning as well, even if they only display a technique at a later date.
 
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evildmguy

Explorer
Wow, some great discussion here! Good ideas to think about.

To add to what I said, I gave up trying to make leveling and training in a fantasy world make sense in terms of time spent from level one to level twenty. It is something I think about and if I can, I have breaks at points to allow for this. I might have them skip adventuring in winter in a northern area as it is too cold and they can make stuff or work on things. I might have festivals or celebrations to add in some time. If I can't, though, because the adventure has a sense of urgency with time, I don't worry about it. I would rather focus on the adventure. That's my approach, anyway.

I will say that I recently tried milestone leveling and once the players got used to not receiving xp, getting a level became a nice surprise, rather than trying to game system for a bit more xp so they could level. Again, it could be explained either way, knowing you almost understand something and pushing until you do. Or the sudden realization that something you have been trying to do worked several times in a row.
 

Ath-kethin

Elder Thing
I've never used any kind of mentorship or training requirements in my games. For context, I started playing D&D with 2nd Edition in 1993 and started running my own games a few months later.

But I look at D&D's class and level systems as descriptive, not prescriptive. That is, a character's class is the broad classification of what they do - a person who primarily pokes things with sharp sticks is classified as a "Fighter," a person who sneaks about and lives by their wits is classified as a "Rogue," etc. A character class doesn't define the character, the character's actions determine their class. It's semantics, but makes the whole system far more sensible in my opinion.

Similarly, we are all accustomed to levels in education; 1st Grade, 2nd Grade, and so forth. How do you move from one to the next? You prove you've met the requirements to do so. So from that perspective a wizard who has mastered the ability to handle powerful magic like fireball has advanced to the 5th level, not the other way around.

Again, it's all semantics, with no real impact on gameplay, but I find most objections to class-based systems fade when we approach it from this perspective.
 


Celebrim

Legend
The training rules as written in AD&D 1e were a product of the large groups and haven/delve format that Gygax was using. Keep in mind Gygax was running a game where each real-world day was a day in the game world. As such, training was in large part a way to discourage people from being problem players, as it gave the DM an excuse to take away their favorite character for a long stretch. I think Gygax also just saw various sorts of value in forcing his players to try out new PCs and have PC's of various different levels, as it meant that whomever showed up they could probably put a party together of similar level without divergent goals.

I think some of the 'West Marches' style games I've seen that are inspired by that early format would benefit from such rules compared to some of the innovations I've seen them use.

Despite being the sort of AD&D referee that like obscure rules like weapon vs. to hit adjustments, I dropped that rule early on because it got in the way of adventure pacing. I wanted PC's to be able to level up in the middle of a lengthy adventure in order to move on to the next phase of whatever epic quest they were on. I didn't want to have to stop the game and let PC's off.
 

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