WotC, 3PP and quality level

[Joe Sala]

Sometimes I read in these forums that the new GSL will avoid one indesirable effect the d20/OGL licenses had: the 90% of crappy books that flooded the market. I know the vast majority of 3PP supplements were terrible, although 90% of published fantasy literature, even mainstream literature, is also crap.

IMHO, 3E WotC books had an average quality. Some of them were very good (the FR and Eberron campaign settings, for example), others were professional but boring or uninspiring. The adventures were not that good, either.

When I look at my library, I can clearly see that the best 3E books were published by 3PP. The Book of the Righteous. Freeport. Midnight. Many Necromancer adventures (The Vault of Larin Karr, The Grey Citadel, A Family Affair...). Paizo's Adventure Paths. These are better books that anything by WotC, and these companies are not going 4E.

I have no time to create my own settings and adventures, so I like buying them and adapting them to my own needs (although I hate system conversions). Now I'm a bit worried: if I switch to 4E and WotC becomes my main supplier of books, I think I will notice a quality decrease.

So what do you think? Should I trust WotC and their writers and editors?

 

[Halivar]

It's too early to tell. Most 3PP's are clearly too scared of the new GSL to jump in. 3PP support for 4E will come nowhere near what you saw with 3E until there are clear commercial successes for 3PP publishers with the GSL. It looks, to me, like the publishers are looking at each other, going, "umm... you first."

I think the upcoming APG is going to get things shaking, one way or the other.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

90% of published fantasy literature, even mainstream literature, is also crap.

Actually, the old quote is more like "90% of everything is crap."

Personally, I think that most of WotC's core stuff and main supplementals (initial campaign setting books, class splatbooks) are usually pretty solid. I may not like every design decision, but I've rarely been actually disappointed...not a big fan of the "Races of..." books, though.

The books in which they try to introduce all new mechanics are a bit more dodgy. I thought the XPH was pretty good, but its followup was trumped by stuff in Dragon. MoI and ToM had some nice concepts, but the classes seem a bit underpowered. On the flipside, the Bo9S classes seemed a bit overpowered.

Of the 3PP, quality is a bit more scattered, IMHO. I liked a lot of Green Ronin's stuff right out of the gate...but I hated so much of Mongoose's early stuff that I almost didn't buy their version of Paranoia, which would have been a mistake. Malhavoc products? Almost a guaranteed buy.

The OGL meant that a lot of substandard stuff was going to hit the market, but it also gave room for some very nice innovators to strut their stuff.

While the GSL may in fact cull much of the weaker products from ever seeing the light of day, but if the better 3PPs stay with 3.X or their version of it, the GSL may also wind up keeping the bad stuff out of 3.X, and letting it in the 4Ed door.

And only time will tell.

I'm sure that most of the guys who worked on 4Ed who also freelance would love to publish under the GSL. The question is whether they can or not...and that may be a matter of cost or a matter of personal views about the GSL itself.

 

[Joe Sala]

I hope the new legal situation doesn't waste the talent of many great D&D authors.

 

[Crothian]

It is fine to trust WotC, just don't do so needlessly. I'm fairly certain I'm going to enjoy most of what WotC makes for 4ed. But that doesn't mean I have to be the first to buy it and talk about it. Wait for others to take the bigger risk for you. People will be talking about and if we get lucky even reviewing these books. Base what you are going to buy off of that information and not just getting something becasue it is 4ed.

 

[questing gm]

It is fine to trust WotC, just don't do so needlessly. I'm fairly certain I'm going to enjoy most of what WotC makes for 4ed. But that doesn't mean I have to be the first to buy it and talk about it. Wait for others to take the bigger risk for you. People will be talking about and if we get lucky even reviewing these books. Base what you are going to buy off of that information and not just getting something becasue it is 4ed.

Agreed.

While I would buy Wizards books that are sure to expand the game with new crunch, I would go for 3PP for extra fluff-based products which WoTC doesn't cover all or at least the ones I want.

I'm still skeptical or hesitant about 3PP crunch books unless it's for a setting (e.g, Midnight, Ptolus).

 

[wedgeski]

During the 3e era, I bought only those books from WotC which I liked the look of, would be useful to me, and got good word of mouth. Even by those criteria, I still bought about 30-40 books. To me that makes them a pretty safe bet.

 

[Ginnel]

Agreed.

While I would buy Wizards books that are sure to expand the game with new crunch, I would go for 3PP for extra fluff-based products which WoTC doesn't cover all or at least the ones I want.

I'm still skeptical or hesitant about 3PP crunch books unless it's for a setting (e.g, Midnight, Ptolus).

This would be my view from what I've seen, 3PP crunch I wouldn't touch with a 10ft pole, dungeon and dragon I'd be cautious of and would have to vett it first, adventure wise sure I'd look wherever for that stuff, but yet again I'd have to vett any new magic items invented in them.

Wizards books on the other hand are mostly useful, magic item and spell compendium and the complete books are my favourites though and if I had to buy the books for 3rd I think these would have been the only ones I would have purchased.

 

[Turanil]

Now I'm a bit worried: if I switch to 4E and WotC becomes my main supplier of books, I think I will notice a quality decrease.

So what do you think?

I think you will see a quality decrease as soon as you get the 4e core books.

 

[dmccoy1693]

EDIT: Posted in wrong thread.... *sigh*