WotC WotC is hiring Senior Manager for Diversity, equity and inclusion.

[doctorbadwolf]

With the name, the effect, and the art that is literally depicting guys in KKK outfits, the multiverse ID just seems like a weird thing to focus on here.

People can concern themselves with multiple things.

But not the association of it to that MTG card. Please try and stay on the topic. Red herrings aren’t beneficial for discussion.

What isn't beneficial is derailing a thread to get up in arms that anyone would possible be glad that a Nazi dog whistle isn't part of an official wotc categorization system anymore.

negligent to ignore an unfortunate coincidence? Really?

Yes. Obviously. It being a "coincidence" is wholly irrelevant once it has been pointed out to the person responsible for maintaining the system, which happened quite a long time ago.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Ok, what was the problem with id number?

Google "1488 dog whistle" if you want to know exactly why it was bad.

And just know that white supremacist in the mtg community have noted the connection, and celebrated it.

 

[Charlaquin]

But not the association of it to that MTG card. Please try and stay on the topic. Red herrings aren’t beneficial for discussion.

It is not without meaning that the card called Invoke Prejudice, with the effect of countering creature spells of colors the user’s creatures don’t share, with art made by a white supremacist, that depicts characters resembling KKK members, has an ID number that is a white supremacist dog whistle. It doesn’t matter that that ID number assignment was coincidental, it still carries meaning. That’s not a red herring, it’s an acknowledgment that outcomes matter more than intent.

 

[Charlaquin]

Note: This is the first I hear of this, and I also don't play the game.

Having said that, when we say "it gets put into the system and gets the next available number", is it really beyond the realm of possibility that someone inserted it at a specific time to get this result?

Not saying that's what happened, of course, only that it's possible. When people who understood the significance of 1) the number and 2) the card and 3) the artist put it all together...well, we couldn't blame them if they wondered if there was some intentionality at work, could we?

Based on how these numbers are assigned, there’s no reasonable way the artist could have influenced things to insure the card got that ID number. It’s also highly unlikely that a developer could have nudged things to line up that way. The number is almost certainly a wild and unfortunate coincidence. That doesn’t make it meaningless though. White supremecists have long observed and celebrated the coincidence. Removing the card’s image from their online database was the right move to make. But it definitely should have been made sooner.

 

[Sacrosanct]

*deleted

 

[FrogReaver]

Based on how these numbers are assigned, there’s no reasonable way the artist could have influenced things to insure the card got that ID number. It’s also highly unlikely that a developer could have nudged things to line up that way. The number is almost certainly a wild and unfortunate coincidence. That doesn’t make it meaningless though. White supremecists have long observed and celebrated the coincidence. Removing the card’s image from their online database was the right move to make. But it definitely should have been made sooner.

@Umbran I think this post contains a most important point and while I don’t want to drag this issue on especially after your mod post I think it’s too important to not point out.

“White Supremacists celebrated this coincidence”. That to me is enough to change my position. It’s not about the coincidence but that a hate group is celebrating that coincidence. I agree it needed addressed, just not for the reason originally given.

 

[Haldrik]

@Umbran I think this post contains a most important point and while I don’t want to drag this issue on especially after your mod post I think it’s too important to not point out.

“White Supremacists celebrated this coincidence”. That to me is enough to change my position. It’s not about the coincidence but that a hate group is celebrating that coincidence. I agree it needed addressed, just not for the reason originally given.

It is wrong that supremacists culturally appropriate what doesnt belong them.

But at least until it is clear that there is no association with the supremacists, it might be expedient for public relations to suspend the use of the appropriated symbol.

 

[FrogReaver]

It is wrong that supremacists culturally appropriate what doesnt belong them.

But at least until it is clear that there is no association with the supremacists, it might be expedient for public relations to suspend the use of the appropriated symbol.

That’s a whole different can of worms and I don’t intend on going any further down that path in this thread. Umbran was kind enough to let my last comment stand and I appreciate that but I won’t take that as a license to ignore his admonition. Perhaps a different thread in a different context we can have that discussion, or at worst in PM.

I’m happy to talk about that WOTC job posting here though.

 

[Gradine]

Whole I don't tend to believe in coincidences (Occam's Razor being what it is) vis-a-vis dog whistles (see the 1488 reference in that recent new WoD product, forget the name), doing a little bit of a dive says that particular dog whistle didn't gain prominence until David Lane's (the coiner of the term) writings were published online by his wife in 1995, a year after the card was published.

Of course, the phrase had existed by then (coined, as it was, it the late 80's) but hardly mainstream in white supremacist circles wit large, and that combined with MTG's rather stringent numbering scheme, makes it feel much less likely that the whole thing was intentional.

It's good it was addressed as part of the larger set of problematics surrounding the card that should have been addressed and corrected long before it actually was.

 

[Haldrik]

@FrogReaver

Returning to the central topic,

The problematic MTG cards, are examples that I expect the "Senior Manager Diversity Equity & Inclusion" to also be on the lookout for. Sometimes, there are unfortunate confluences, that are unintentional, whether accidental or uncritical reuse of tropes.

In other words, I assume this Manager will be responsible for monitoring the content of D&D products, as well as informing the personnel that creates this content.