[WOTC] Minis Spotlight

mmu1 said:
Does anyone know if they're being made from the same crappy, bendy rubber-like stuff they use for HeroClix stuff, that makes for L-shaped swords you can never get to stay straight?

From the look on at the website pictures, I'd say it's somewhere between the original Mage Knight figures & the newer ones. The early ones were a very cheap rubbery plastic. The newer ones are reasonably solid and allow WizKids to make much better sculpts (you should see the upcoming set figures - every set WizKids get's better in better in productions).

This looks like it's much better than the original, but it seems to still have a certain amount of "softness" to it. Then again, it's very hard to tell from a picture.

Glyfair of Glamis
 

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Conaill said:

BTW, anyone know what the working conditions are in these factories? Must be extremely low apyed, and working with paint all day isn't exactly good for your health either...

Actually, I've seen more than one article on the conditions of factories in China. The pay sucks but the factories are clean, well lit and pretty decent. The quality of the factory is how they get workers. I think many people would be surprised by just how much is manufactured in China.

This brings up a major problem though: Delays because product is being shipped from China and has to go through customs. Just by looking at the delays and allocations from WizKid product, WotC is going to be running into the same problems.

I know I'm an exception to most retailers but if I ever need minis in a hurry from Reaper I can literally drive 15 minutes and pick them up directly from Reaper HQ. Heck, in less than a year Reaper HQwill be in the same town as my store as they're moving here!

I'm thinking the WotC minis are just not going to go over here.

~D
 

Well Regdar for one is looking forward to these new mini's, Regdar rarely has the time to paint anymore and fodder is always welcome.
 

I LIKE THEM

Yep sorry to say it but I LIKE THEM.

I paint a figure or two every now and then but dont have the time to sit and paint alot of figures. And i must say that my painting is not the best. I for one will be buying these minis. I think they are great. I wouldnt use them for PC's. But for your average encounters they are wonderful.

Sorry to be one of the few voices in the crowd who likes them, but i do..

:D :) :D
 

Regdar said:
Well Regdar for one is looking forward to these new mini's, Regdar rarely has the time to paint anymore and fodder is always welcome.

Count Felon in too, Regdar. Felon hears a lot of criticism of the new line, but Felon only hears dead silence when it comes to suggesting an alternative source for inexpensive, pre-assembled, pre-painted miniatures for fantasy gaming. The options Felon will have come September is nigh-infinitely better than what he has now.

The fact that even Wizkids isn't attempting this, even though they already have a rock-solid foot in the market makes Felon think that this is a riskier venture for a company to undertake than a lot of us can appreciate.

Furthermore, Felon finds it confusing that some people lambast the paintjobs done on the minis and then say that they're just going to go buy Reaper or GWS minis. To Felon's understanding, Reaper and GWS's minis are all unpainted. Why can't the D&D minis be primed and painted just like the less-affordable unpainted figures?
 
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A couple of reasons:

1. If you buy GW plastic regiments, the cost per figure is actually cheaper--particularly if you get them at a discount. (Satisfied customer report: I've used Great Canadian Miniatures-- www.gc-minis.com --in the past but with the Canadian dollar as high as it is, I don't know if they're still the same deal they used to be). And they're easily customizable and look like they have more detail.

Better minis, less money, but you have to paint them yourself.

2. Since paint tends to fill in details and these are already painted, repriming and repainting them will result in less detailed miniatures unless you strip the paint first--which is more work.

3. If they're like Wizkids minis, the quality of the mold and plastic doesn't hold as much detail (although it is more durable--I see people just toss a bunch of wizkids minis in a tacklebox all the time and pull them out without any noticable damage beyond a bent sword; if I tried that with my minis, I'd be spending a half hour with superglue before starting any game).

As I said before, these are better than I thought but still aren't impressive and I don't like blind packaging. But if a secondary market develops, I'll probably pick up some cheap and interesting commons--durable minis I don't have to paint are a good thing.

Felon said:
Furthermore, Felon finds it confusing that some people lambast the paintjobs done on the minis and then say that they're just going to go buy Reaper or GWS minis. To Felon's understanding, Reaper and GWS's minis are all unpainted. Why can't the D&D minis be primed and painted just like the less-affordable unpainted figures?
 

I think they're great. I do not have the time or money to go around painting miniatures.

Incidentally, here's some maths for you.

Assuming "perfect" distribution (hah!), you need to buy 27 boosters to get 1 of every miniature.

You will have:
27 rares
81 uncommons
108 commons

(Now, the difference in # between uncommons and commons doesn't seem to pronounced at the moment... however, let's go to the next stage).

Of each individual figure, you'll have:
27/27 = 1 of each rare
81/33 = 2.45 of each uncommon, and
108/20 = 5.4 of each common

That gives you the corrected distribution figures: 1 rare : 2.45 uncommon : 5.4 common - also 1 uncommon : 2.2 commons

When you look at those numbers, the difference between rares and commons is 1:5.4, which really isn't that bad. (In Magic, it's 1:11, btw).

Cheers!
 

Elder-Basilisk said:
But if a secondary market develops, I'll probably pick up some cheap and interesting commons--durable minis I don't have to paint are a good thing.


I wouldn't worry about whether or not a secondary market opens up, I guarantee that one will open up. It was seen after Mage Knight opened up, it was seen after Heroclix. It will happen when these new D&D minis hit the shelves. No doubt about it.

I still say that a lot of people are looking at it from the wrong angle. WotC tried to go toe to toe with Reaper and GW and lost, so now they are hitting a market that is not as tried and true as others, the pre-painted minis market. Sure, the quality of the paintjobs suck compared to someone that has some experience painting, but that's the way it goes. You're not going to find cheap pre-painted (good quality paint jobs) minis (4-5 a box) for under $5 ANYWHERE. If you do, more power to you and I assure you, you won't find them for long. The long and short is that this is an entry product for newbies to the D&D world or a product for those that don't have the time to spend painting goblin after goblin for that random encounter. They are mass produced are aren't going to look great on every table, but they are serviceable. I think too many people are looking for too good of a buy for too little money. You want a good or better pre-painted min? Go look on eBay. You get 1 for the cost of a booster of 4 (or however many WotC decided they are going to sell in a box). The WotC minis aren't really for me, but I know many new and old gamers that would love to have them at their table.

Kane
 

PAINT JOB
I'm amused by the folks that point out that mass-produced plastic minis painted in 15 minutes on a production line in China don't look as good as metal minis painted in 8 hours by a dedicated miniature painting enthusiast in his basement.

Well... duh. :)

Similar news flash: a Toyota Camry isn't as fast or luxurious as a Ferrari. But surprise! Camry is the best selling car in America. The Camry is not a car enthusiast's car. But it's good enough for the vast majority of car buyers--it gets the job done, and for most people that's good enough.

Plastic minis are for mass market gamers, not for miniatures enthusiasts. If you don't like the plastic minis because they don't look as good as your metal minis, that's fine, but that doesn't mean that WotC is stupid--you aren't the target customer.

Bonus: unlike with hand painted gorgeous metal minis, you don't have to have a heart attack every time someone drops your D&D Miniatures mini, or picks it up with cheetos-stained fingers, or sweeps them all off the battlemat in one swoop, or manually depicts how "the dragon swoops you up--like this--then drops you to the ground far below--like this--where as you can see, the impact knocks your companions off their feet. And, apparently, sends Lidda into a nearby pool of guacamole. Er--I mean green slime."

RANDOM PACKAGING
I can sympathize with the folks that complain about the random packaging. As a D&D RPG player, I'd like to be able to buy a cheap pack of gnolls or wights or whatever. But with this new collectable D&D Miniatures game WotC is primarily targeting collectable minitaures gamers, not D&D players. Sure, they'll try to get D&D players to buy and try out the new game as well (as someone earlier pointed out), but that's gravy--this is a new game, packaged in the way that's best suited for that particular type of game (as someone earlier pointed out).

Fortunately for D&D RPG players a secondary market will exist. If you want to buy a certain miniature, and for whatever reason you don't want to buy any of the untold thousands of metal miniatures available from the dozens of metal miniatures makers, then you'll be able to buy it from Joe Gamer via eBay.

Speaking of those untold thousands of individually packaged metal minis made by dozens of metal mini makers... It's often really hard to find the exact mini you want. Physical stores have limited shelf space, and it's just too expensive for them to take inventory risk on unusual minis... they usually only carry a small selection of minis from a couple of the most popular manufacturers (GW, Reaper). Hmmm... maybe WotC's "only two SKUs" strategy makes sense.... it's a way for them to get a selection of 80 minis into a store, and the store only has to order 2 SKUs. Hmm...

SEALED DECK DUNGEONS
The guy that mocked the sealed deck dungeon/encounter idea didn't really think things through. Of course you wouldn't just dump out the contents of a box and say "Okay, you fight all this."

No. Remember that each mini has a point cost.

The DM or organizer of the tournament would impose some form of rules that would level the playing field and make encounters appropriate. Such as... "100 point limit for armies" (for a tournament) or "No single encounter can exceed 20 points, and the whole dungeon must be 100 points or less" (for an encounter/dungeon).

Clearly you wouldn't want random dungeons to be the norm, but they might be a fun change of pace.

***

This post is not intended as an insult, just friendly jibing. :) All I want is for my fellow gamers to keep an open mind, to evaluate this new product as a new product, and to think about the fun possibilities that this new game brings to the table.

-z

D&D Miniatures is a new game. The miniatures are figures for this new game. The figures can also be used in D&D the RPG.
 

I too will say I like these. I'm an average painter, and just do not have the time. I like MageKnight, and anything that will be similar. not take time to set up and can be used in D&D is good by me.
 

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