D&D General WotC: Novels & Non-5E Lore Are Officially Not Canon

At a media press briefing last week, WotC's Jeremey Crawford clarified what is and is not canon for D&D. "For many years, we in the Dungeons & Dragons RPG studio have considered things like D&D novels, D&D video games, D&D comic books, as wonderful expressions of D&D storytelling and D&D lore, but they are not canonical for the D&D roleplaying game." "If you’re looking for what’s official...

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At a media press briefing last week, WotC's Jeremey Crawford clarified what is and is not canon for D&D.

"For many years, we in the Dungeons & Dragons RPG studio have considered things like D&D novels, D&D video games, D&D comic books, as wonderful expressions of D&D storytelling and D&D lore, but they are not canonical for the D&D roleplaying game."


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"If you’re looking for what’s official in the D&D roleplaying game, it’s what appears in the products for the roleplaying game. Basically, our stance is that if it has not appeared in a book since 2014, we don’t consider it canonical for the games."

2014 is the year that D&D 5th Edition launched.

He goes on to say that WotC takes inspiration from past lore and sometimes adds them into official lore.

Over the past five decades of D&D, there have been hundreds of novels, more than five editions of the game, about a hundred video games, and various other items such as comic books, and more. None of this is canon. Crawford explains that this is because they "don’t want DMs to feel that in order to run the game, they need to read a certain set of novels."

He cites the Dragonlance adventures, specifically.
 

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dragoner

KosmicRPG.com
Smart fridges monitor what you've got in your fridge and how fast you go through it, both to notify you to buy more and to contact vendors so they can send you coupons.

I don't need a household appliance putting me on blast about how the few vegetables I purchase so often go to waste.
Even then it would be critical: "How many times are you going to eat eggs, potatoes, with onions and garlic?" Yum, put some cheese on it.

Though I did read a joke, maybe on twitter:
"Would you like six eggs?"
Me: "Oh, no."
"How about boiled, the yolks whipped with mayo, and sprinkled with paprika?"
Me: "Alrighty then ..."

Which is probably a good example for lore in general, some like it, some don't, and others will consume it if presented differently.
 

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I get that and mostly agree.

But that's why it's really worth stressing the nature of this announcement (something I don't think has been done enough in this long, long, thread).

Crawford is being extremely specific. He's saying the back lore (prior to 2014) is not cannon for the roleplaying game not the novel lines etc. So if a game supplement comes out, it might not be 100% tied to prior lore. That's it. And frankly, they've ALWAYS done that re: the game books - this time Crawford is just saying it out loud.
I think you're right. The DMG has always called out the TTRPG portion of their IP as an alternate reality/mirror universe of what happens in their games, books, etc.

So nothing has really changed. The announcement was just phrased badly. And I can't hold that against anybody, not after doing it so often myself.

I DO wonder how this interacts with Ed Greenwoods legal canon policy?
 
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We older players are heavily invested in that lore in large part because it was new at the time we first engaged with it. New players are going to prefer new lore, that is revealed and unfolding as they are playing, relevant to the adventures they undertake.
I think this is spot on. Only thing I’d add, though, is that it’s possible to present old lore in the context of times and places for campaign settings, but this has to be done explicitly. Delta Green is great at that. The Handler’s book has a massive timeline, just wall to wall lore, but each era described has a section with tips on doing a campaign, including story hooks. You’d have to do some work yourself since the published adventures are usually either in the 90s or present-day, but even those tips and the thought experiments about other-era campaigns make the lore feel like more than just history.
 

Faolyn

(she/her)
I understand that concern, but I can't help but wonder if it's overstated. Leaving aside how the 5E DMG expressly addresses that, and how things like wikis help with that, I think that most players would be fine with that; having someone go "well, actually" doesn't seem like the sort of thing that destroys games. If it does, I'd posit that's an issue with the player, rather than the material.
I don't think it would destroy games, but it can make the games unwieldy or annoying. Especially if you have players who don't know what is or isn't canon or what the DM is accepting as canon. So you could end up with a player making a cool character based around some interesting bit of lore they found only to discover that the DM hadn't planned around that bit of lore (and therefore might have a difficult time integrating that character into the game problem) or didn't like it (in which case the character would be a problem for the game itself). Either of these problems can be worked around, maybe.

"My character did a thing related to the Spellplague and it's part of their identity!"

"Yeah, I'm not using the Spellplague or anything about it."
 

Alzrius

The EN World kitten
I don't think it would destroy games, but it can make the games unwieldy or annoying. Especially if you have players who don't know what is or isn't canon or what the DM is accepting as canon. So you could end up with a player making a cool character based around some interesting bit of lore they found only to discover that the DM hadn't planned around that bit of lore (and therefore might have a difficult time integrating that character into the game problem) or didn't like it (in which case the character would be a problem for the game itself). Either of these problems can be worked around, maybe.

"My character did a thing related to the Spellplague and it's part of their identity!"

"Yeah, I'm not using the Spellplague or anything about it."
I thought Session 0 was all about avoiding resolving exactly this problem. I mean, there might be a disconnect between expectations on the part of the player and the DM, but that's not necessarily a lore thing per se. If you want to run a monk character who's a masked luchador wrestler, and the DM wants to run a gritty horror campaign, there's going to need to be some discussions about how to make those work, or what to do if they can't be reconciled (and I speak from experience regarding those particular examples).
 

Steampunkette

Rules Tinkerer and Freelance Writer
Supporter
I thought Session 0 was all about avoiding resolving exactly this problem. I mean, there might be a disconnect between expectations on the part of the player and the DM, but that's not necessarily a lore thing per se. If you want to run a monk character who's a masked luchador wrestler, and the DM wants to run a gritty horror campaign, there's going to need to be some discussions about how to make those work, or what to do if they can't be reconciled (and I speak from experience regarding those particular examples).
Sure thing!

You can also be like "While WotC doesn't consider the Time of Troubles to be an important part of the Canon, it'll be the basis of a lot of things in this adventure. So here's what your characters would probably know about it based on their backgrounds and stuff."

Which is just peachy keen and also part of what the Crawford is saying...

You CAN use all this Lore, but we're not going to FORCE you to know it going forward.
 

UngainlyTitan

Legend
Supporter
@Alzrius Ok, interesting post but I still have a question, does it matter that the lore exits or does it matter more that it has an official stamp of approval?
I mean I appreciate that people are interested in lore and continuity, I have been interested and engaged with lore in the past but if official lore goes in a direction that I do not like or contradicts previous lore I pick what I like.
For instance, once upon a time I was very invested in Buffy the Vampire Slayer, but only the TV show as broadcast. I was not too enamoured in the later seasons and checked out the Season 8 comic. Decided that I really did not like the direction it was going and despite its Joss Whedon origins I ignore it, it is not part my head canon, despite it presence in the "Official Buffy canon".
 

Chaosmancer

Legend
No, it's not. It's much, much more than that.

A lot of what I've seen in this thread has touched upon issues that ultimately boil down to "why is 'canon' important to people in the first place?" I can give my answer, but this is going to be a bit of a long one, so I'm going to do this @Snarf Zagyg style.

MODES OF ENGAGEMENT: DIFFERENT WAYS TO PLAY (OR NOT PLAY, AS IT WERE)

I've recently been reading Joseph Laycock's book Dangerous Games: What the Moral Panic over Role-Playing Games Says about Play, Religion, and Imagined Worlds, which is aimed at understanding the frenzy that fell over D&D (and other tabletop RPGs) during the 80s and 90s. It's an excellent deep-dive into what happened, and I encourage everyone to read it. But what does that have to do with canon? Well, quite a bit, actually, the first point of which is to help lay down some ways of looking at points that have only been lightly acknowledged so far.

One of the ways that Laycock indicts the people who were panicking over D&D is that they were wrong to say that role-players frequently lost the ability to tell reality from the game world. In fact, he asserts, game-players were easily able to maneuver through three different modes of engagement while sitting around the game table:
  • Mode 1: Reality is where the players acknowledged what was going on around them, without reference to what was happening in the context of game-play (i.e. "Hey, can you check under the couch? I think my d20 might have rolled under there.")
  • Mode 2: Meta-context has the players engaging with the game in its framework as a game, typically via out-of-character references to the rules of the game world and the actions performed with regard to them (i.e. "I make a Charisma check to intimidate the guard. Don't forget my +2 bonus from that non-weapon proficiency I picked up last level.")
  • Mode 3: In-character is when the players act as if they were their character, which is almost always limited to in-character speech (i.e. "By the light of Pelor, you shall burn away to nothing, vampire!")
Obviously, gamers had no real issue with moving between all three modes without any sort of overt signalling that they were doing so; it was understood.

While that might seem like something of a digression, I bring it up here because something similar is going on with regard to discussions of canon. Namely, that we're referencing different modes of engagement with the game. It's just that the engagement isn't with different levels of play, but whether or not we're playing at all.

LEVELING UP THE "ART APPRECIATION" SKILL

While it can be contentious to try and define what "art" is, trying to figure out what constitutes "good art" and "bad art" is even more so. But at the risk of starting an entirely new debate, I'll offer a definition: "good art" is that which is able to engage the people who view (or read, listen to, or otherwise partake of) it on multiple levels simultaneously.

What does "more than one level" of appreciation mean? Well, take a look at the following:

Gattamelata.jpg


That's the Equestrian statue of Gattamelata, sculpted by Donatello (the person, not the ninja turtle in 1453. To me, this piece is pleasing on two levels: it can be appreciated for its technical skill, and for the history it evokes, as Gattamelata was himself an actual person ("Gattamelata" meaning "sweet cat"; notice my avatar here and all).

Now take a look at this one:

800px-Venere_Callipige_Napoli.jpg


That's Venus Callipyge (or rather, a reproduction of it). Made in Greek antiquity, this is one I can appreciate on three levels: the aforementioned technical skill, the historical associations surrounding the statue (I actually found out about it when researching the Deipnosophists), and for the erotic appeal of a hot chick admiring her own naked butt.

Now obviously, there's no expectation that these particular appreciations will be true for anyone else. Someone else may find no attractive qualities in Venus Callipyge, but might find Gattamelata to be smokin' hot. Which is fine; the subjective nature of the appeal is understood, oftentimes to the point where it can be easily overlooked. I think that's what's happening with our discussions on canon: the appeal of how useful lore is with regard to forming a campaign isn't being separated - in the context of what's being discussed - from the appeal of the lore unto itself, when in fact those are different modes.

Of course, this then brings us to ask why the lore is appealing "unto itself" anyway. Which brings us to a new point in the discussion.

JOURNEYING TO ANOTHER WORLD (WITHOUT GOING FULL ISEKAI)

In her book Why We Read Fiction: Theory of Mind and the Novel, Lisa Zunshine posits that reading, like writing, is inherently a creative act. The reason for this boils down to how we fill in the "gaps" in what's there; that we read between the lines to a far greater degree than is commonly acknowledged. That is, that while we might read a passage about a knight charging a dragon, we're imagining the various details that go unwritten in that passage: about the fear the knight is feeling and how they're dealing with it, or perhaps that they're excited rather than afraid, or perhaps that they're filled with a quiet resignation, experiencing neither excitement nor dread.

Like with art appreciation, none of these are right or wrong, because they're all personal, but here we're doing more than just acknowledging what's there: we're adding to it, even if only in the context of our own minds.

But again, what does that have to do with canon?

To that, I offer the following, from Penny Arcade:

241967029_3V9PQ-L-2.jpg


As amusing as that is (a reference to characters from Star Wars appearing in Soul Calibur IV), it's the text that accompanies the comic that I found memorable, where Jerry Holkins wrote:



That, right there, is what it's all about.

If we've established that a body of fiction - whether it's part of a video game franchise, a series of novels, the world of a tabletop role-playing game, etc. - can be approached in multiple different ways, and that one of those is to engage with the fiction as fiction (rather than a framework for game-play, a source of inspiration for some other creative impetus, etc.), then we can take that to the conclusion Holkins has reached here: that the more there is for us to partake in, the more we understand the internal logic and self-consistently of that imaginary world, and so we can then in turn fill in more details on our own, and enjoy it more richly.

It might sound paradoxical to say that the more we know about a given piece of fiction, the more we can make up, but that's been my experience in fandom after fandom. We want to know more about a particular imaginary world because it makes it clearer in our minds. Harry Potter fans want to know what the wizarding world looks like outside of England, or what it was like in the past. Kingdom Hearts fans want to explore the nature of the various settings of the series and expand connections between them and their characters. A Song of Ice and Fire fans want to explore beyond Westeros and learn about the various histories teased throughout the books (the TV series, not so much).

And fans of the Forgotten Realms want to understand the nature of that setting better also.

No disagreements with any of this.

To that end, "canon" as a concept is important because it's the guide by which we determine what does that for us and what doesn't. A particular piece of fanfiction about The Lord of the Rings might be a masterpiece in its own right - and if you haven't read The Last Ringbearer, you should - but it doesn't help a Lord of the Rings fan understand Middle-Earth better. It's a different mode of engagement, one that goes for entertainment without widening the conceptual framework that is the imaginary world and its history, characters, etc.

At least, that's what canon is to me, and why I think it's important. It's why I don't want various aspects of a setting changed - and when I say "changed," I mean meta-contextually changed; if Thay didn't originally sell magic items to other nations, and then in later editions was selling them to any and all, that's fine if it's because Szass Tam elected to change Thay's foreign policy as a matter of shoring up political influence abroad - for reasons that don't relate to in-setting reasons (e.g. some people find it offensive, it's perceived as being too off-putting for newcomers, etc.) Doing so makes it harder to engage with that fantasy world under the mode with which I'm trying to engage with it: as its own thing, separate and apart from any changes or alterations that I might introduce to it on my own (that's a mode of engagement that I reserve for game-play).

The same way having rules grounds and stabilizes what's otherwise a game of "let's pretend," canon is the set of rules by which we interact with an imaginary world. Without it, there's no sense of structure to the fantasy, and it's no more entertaining than trying to play a game of make-believe completely on your own.

That's why I think a lot of people are upset about this, because a method of engaging with the setting has been impacted, one which is keenly perceived even if it's entirely conceptual in nature.

TL;DR Canon is important because it's the framework that people use to engage with an imaginary world, giving structure to fantasy, and in so doing making it seem real enough to be entertaining.

And here is where I don't really disagree, but that I think the point gets muddled and lost.

Let us say Canon is the ground you stand on. And let us say you have a kingdom built on a volcanic island like O'ahu. Then one day the King decides to move the kingdom to the new island, like Kaho'olawe.

To the king and the kingdom, they are now living on this new island. With this new canon... but O'ahu still exists. Nothing was torn down, the buildings are just empty. And you can still go live on O'ahu.

The reason I'm using a volcanic island chain as my example is because "canon" in terms of the ground, can never go away. Nothing WoTC can ever possibly do can destroy this island that you are living on, the ground that you are standing on. It exists, and now that it exists, it isn't going anywhere until time erodes it away like it does all things. What is being done is that the kingdom is moving to a new island. A smaller island, and it may not look the same as the old one. And if the world keeps shifting, this new island might get abandoned for an even newer island, that's just what happens.

Maybe this is a problem of language. I've been thinking of "canon" as "the official canon being utilized" and maybe for other people it is "the continuity of knowledge and lore". But just like The Last Ringbearer didn't destroy Tolkien, nothing WoTC is doing now destroys the lore of 2e or 3.X. It is still in the museum. Still floating nearby in the ocean. Still accessible and still usable... it just isn't where WoTC is going to be building.

And that for me is why this isn't a big deal. I can fully integrate and imagine multiple different realities where multiple different things are true. Maybe in the 2000's canon Szass Tam wasn't selling magic items and in the 2030's canon he was selling magic items. Both worlds can exist. Pick which one you prefer to use and make your island to build upon. The company picked 2030. You don't have to.
 

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