D&D General WotC: 'Of Course We're Going To Do' Baldur's Gate 4

“Baldur’s Gate is an incredible game. And of course, we're going to do a successor."
baldurs-gate-3-review-in-progress.jpeg


In an interview with The Game Business, Wizards of the Coast's president John Hight touched on the company's video games plans for Dungeons & Dragons.

Hight told interviewer Christopher Dring “Baldur’s Gate is an incredible game. And of course, we're going to do a successor."

Larian Studios, which made Baldur's Gate 3, has previously indicated that is not going to be involved in any potential sequels.

However, the previously announced game that game studio Giant Skull is currently working on is not Baldur's Gate 4. Hight says "This is not the successor to [Baldur's Gate 3]. We go to Stig and his team to tell an incredible story and bring D&D to a very broad audience. Ideally, the game will appeal to D&D players because it will help them realise their imagination. But it’s also going to hopefully appeal to people that love playing action games, that love the Jedi games, that love God of War games." Giant Skull's game will be a single-player action-adventure game.

Giant Skull's Stig Asmussen spoke a little about that--as yet untitled--game: "A lot of us have grown up on Dungeons & Dragons. And for me, with a new company, this is something that we’re good at. We're good at working with partners. We're good at capturing the spirit of those worlds. It wasn't something that we could just walk away from. It was actually a pretty easy [decision]... Dungeons & Dragons is the definition of a playground. When we had the meeting in Renton [Washington], my mind opened up to the possibilities of what we could do. There’s still a lot of things that we have to abide by. There’s the spirit of Dungeons & Dragons. There are the worlds, player agency and choice, building a party, actions have consequences… those types of things."

Giant Skull was founded by Stig Asmussen in 2023. Asmussen previously was the game director of Star Wars Jedi: Survivor and Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order, as well as God of War 3.

 

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I personally believe that Sigil was an attempt at empire building by someone(s) and an attempt to replace Beyond. Mostly due to the fact that it appears to ignore all the benefits that Beyond integration could provide.
Work on Sigil started before the Beyond acquisition, and head of WotC's digital was actually opposed to the Beyond acquisition (this came out, of all times, during the OGL 2.0 deal), so yeah I don't think there's any question internal politics was in play here.

Interesting re: the small updates - it's more than nothing!

I always thought that Sigil was premature. A 2D VTT is relatively simple compared to 3D, building a 3D map is time consuming and one area that strikes me as ideal for AI automation. Create something that can transform a 2D map into 3D and allow the addition of decor, set dressing and does fog of war, line of sight.
Yeah that was striking, given literally no-one had successfully made a fully-featured 3D VTT successfully before. Some real "running before walking" stuff.
 

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Work on Sigil started before the Beyond acquisition, and head of WotC's digital was actually opposed to the Beyond acquisition (this came out, of all times, during the OGL 2.0 deal), so yeah I don't think there's any question internal politics was in play here.
I did not know they had started before the Beyond acquisition, pretty short sighted in my opinion. A case of "not invented here". If they had embraced Beyond, integrated with and built out dual use stuff, a 2d VTT, encounter and campaign management with a smaller unit working on the 3d engine they might have saved some or all of their jobs.
Interesting re: the small updates - it's more than nothing!


Yeah that was striking, given literally no-one had successfully made a fully-featured 3D VTT successfully before. Some real "running before walking" stuff.

I think to make 3D VTT really shine, it needs cheap and fairly ubiquitous AR tech, the kind that Microsoft was mucking about with 10 years ago with Kinect and Hololens. But at less than $200 a pop. Especially if one can manage mixed reality.
 


I personally believe that Sigil was an attempt at empire building by someone(s) and an attempt to replace Beyond. Mostly due to the fact that it appears to ignore all the benefits that Beyond integration could provide.
It was Chris Cao, who succed3d with Magic Arena, and they started before WotC bought Beyond.
 


Just thinking about D&DBeyond from the player or DM perspective, if the current campaign notes and players notes where replaced with a blog (or microblog in the case of the players) where the updates could be added as separate post and the different post hyperlinked to (perhaps adding some tagging) this would go a long way to making it useful for campaign management.

Add in some social tools, like blogging, and a way to search the old articles and pin interesting articles and the whole site become much more usable.
I always thought that many of the concepts behind Gleemax were sound it was the execution and UI that sucked beyond belief.
 

I think to make 3D VTT really shine, it needs cheap and fairly ubiquitous AR tech, the kind that Microsoft was mucking about with 10 years ago with Kinect and Hololens. But at less than $200 a pop. Especially if one can manage mixed reality.
AR and VR both just keep swinging and missing, over and over and over, have done for my whole lifetime and I'm 47 man, because it's a solution looking for a problem, and not willing to wait the tech is so good it might become viable, because that might mean a competitor got there first. The last 10-12 years, even single year we've had to hear about how it's NEXT year that VR/AR becomes big. Oh obviously that thing we were told was going to be huge by a zillion breathless head-empty articles failed! Everyone one knew it would! < furiously deletes articles saying it was a sure thing > But look at this nearly identical thing! Now this is going to work!*

That's been the hallmark of a significant and perhaps increasing proportion of silicon valley tech and software for the last 35 years. At least one of three errors is made, often more than one:

1) Instead of identifying an actual problem, an actual need, an actual gap in the market based on real consumer desire or solid unmotivated research or the like, a company or even a sizeable proportion of Silicon Valley and VCs who invest in software and tech psychs themselves, via echo chambers and backpatting into believing, with huge certainty, that there's gap in the market, that's a tech people desperately want. Bonus points if it's not a linear improvement on an existing tech, but something entirely new. They bring the product to market, and the sort of enthusiasts who always buy everything their neophilia is pointed at, buy it, the companies claim it's going great... and... POOF the bubble burst, the illusion fails. Then it's everyone's fault but the tech companies and the VCs. "People just aren't ready" is the usual one.

2) A real problem is identified, a real need, a real benefit - but it's small and specific and doesn't justify huge investment, really a specialist firm rather than a big generalist should be dealing with it. But then self-psych-out starts, and they start coming up with reasons, often obviously spurious reasons why instead of this being applicable to say, 5% of surgeons doing a specific kind of operation, it's gonna be used to every single medical professional, no, every professional, no everyone who does any kind of job will need this! No still not enough! Now everyone will need it and want! It's the new iPhone it's always the new iPhone! Never mind that, blather articles aside, the iPhone was an iteration of an existing technology, not a revolution. Never mind mobile phone usage was already rocketing upwards at an unstoppable pace and a better mobile phone was a no-brainer (especially virtually every concept in the iPhone had already been tried by another one, just clunkily). No that one device was by itself a revolution, nobody really had mobiles before that, the Blackberry was a mass delusion and so on. Our product is just like the magical perfect revolutionary iPhone we've False Memory Syndrome'd into believing was A Thing! And of course then it flops.

3) Concept is sound, but the tech ain't there, or both that and there's a missing conceptual chunk. Often you can move a smallish number of units if this is the case, but people will tend to bounce of the tech unless they have an incredible use-case. This is less delusional, but it's still a bit silly, and sometimes the tech is really, really, really not there. This is really common though - the Palm Pilot is a pretty perfect example. VR/AR might be this, but if so, despite some incredible tech and cheap tech, and even Apple getting in on it (remember that? It was last year, but feels like 10 years ago), it's consistently failed and failed to be anything more than a gimmick or niche-of-niche. Studies show over and over that people do buy them, it's not that they don't sell at least okay-ish (not amazing but units are moved). My brother has two! It's that, reliable as clockwork, people use it quite often for like, 2-6 weeks, and then usage drops, and drops, and drops, pretty fast, and get to either zero or a pretty low level. Maybe the kids bring it out occasionally to play a specific game for a year or three, maybe a super-niche-hobbyist sim guy plays an unpopular sim with it, but that's not going to cut it, especially because they eventually stop too.

So I don't think that's the issue. I think it's going to keep failing until we have something a lot more like a neural jack than VR/AR, and that might well be never. The advance of technology stopped being inevitable in our lifetimes.

* = Tech journalism is basically just Dastardly from Stop That Pigeon.
 
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AR and VR both just keep swinging and missing, over and over and over, have done for my whole lifetime and I'm 47 man, because it's a solution looking for a problem, and not willing to wait the tech is so good it might become viable, because that might mean a competitor got there first. The last 10-12 years, even single year we've had to hear about how it's NEXT year that VR/AR becomes big. Oh obviously that thing we were told was going to be huge by a zillion breathless head-empty articles failed! Everyone one knew it would! < furiously deletes articles saying it was a sure thing > But look at this nearly identical thing! Now this is going to work!*

That's been the hallmark of a significant and perhaps increasing proportion of silicon valley tech and software for the last 35 years. At least one of three errors is made, often more than one:

1) Instead of identifying an actual problem, an actual need, an actual gap in the market based on real consumer desire or solid unmotivated research or the like, a company or even a sizeable proportion of Silicon Valley and VCs who invest in software and tech psychs themselves, via echo chambers and backpatting into believing, with huge certainty, that there's gap in the market, that's a tech people desperately want. Bonus points if it's not a linear improvement on an existing tech, but something entirely new. They bring the product to market, and the sort of enthusiasts who always buy everything their neophilia is pointed at, buy it, the companies claim it's going great... and... POOF the bubble burst, the illusion fails. Then it's everyone's fault but the tech companies and the VCs. "People just aren't ready" is the usual one.

2) A real problem is identified, a real need, a real benefit - but it's small and specific and doesn't justify huge investment, really a specialist firm rather than a big generalist should be dealing with it. But then self-psych-out starts, and they start coming up with reasons, often obviously spurious reasons why instead of this being applicable to say, 5% of surgeons doing a specific kind of operation, it's gonna be used to every single medical professional, no, every professional, no everyone who does any kind of job will need this! No still not enough! Now everyone will need it and want! It's the new iPhone it's always the new iPhone! Never mind that, blather articles aside, the iPhone was an iteration of an existing technology, not a revolution. Never mind mobile phone usage was already rocketing upwards at an unstoppable pace and a better mobile phone was a no-brainer (especially virtually every concept in the iPhone had already been tried by another one, just clunkily). No that one device was by itself a revolution, nobody really had mobiles before that, the Blackberry was a mass delusion and so on. Our product is just like the magical perfect revolutionary iPhone we've False Memory Syndrome'd into believing was A Thing! And of course then it flops.

3) Concept is sound, but the tech ain't there, or both that and there's a missing conceptual chunk. Often you can move a smallish number of units if this is the case, but people will tend to bounce of the tech unless they have an incredible use-case. This is less delusional, but it's still a bit silly, and sometimes the tech is really, really, really not there. This is really common though - the Palm Pilot is a pretty perfect example. VR/AR might be this, but if so, despite some incredible tech and cheap tech, and even Apple getting in on it (remember that? It was last year, but feels like 10 years ago), it's consistently failed and failed to be anything more than a gimmick or niche-of-niche. Studies show over and over that people do buy them, it's not that they don't sell at least okay-ish (not amazing but units are moved). My brother has two! It's that, reliable as clockwork, people use it quite often for like, 2-6 weeks, and then usage drops, and drops, and drops, pretty fast, and get to either zero or a pretty low level. Maybe the kids bring it out occasionally to play a specific game for a year or three, maybe a super-niche-hobbyist sim guy plays an unpopular sim with it, but that's not going to cut it, especially because they eventually stop too.

So I don't think that's the issue. I think it's going to keep failing until we have something a lot more like a neural jack than VR/AR, and that might well be never. The advance of technology stopped being inevitable in our lifetimes.

* = Tech journalism is basically just Dastardly from Stop That Pigeon.
A lot of Silicon Valley has been driven by sci fi from the sixties, seventies and eighties that they grew up with and thought was cool. I also do not think that it will need a neural jack but really cheap light batteries and a lightweight headset. I think the real use case is drone war operations and battlefield information management. The US military are spending 22 billion on it.
Will it work, I do not know, but if it does, I could see it spread out from there.

I am not claiming that this is the next big thing, or will ever be a thing, but if it became a thing, I could see 3dVTT being useful at that point.
 

I also do not think that it will need a neural jack but really cheap light batteries and a lightweight headset.
We've got that. It doesn't solve any fundamental issues. The lightest ones aren't cheap but are insanely light but the wealthy people who buy them follow the exact pattern everyone does - 2-6 weeks of "Wow" followed by a few months of "Oh yeah, I guess I could" followed by "Meh, can't be bothered".

I think the real use case is drone war operations and battlefield information management. The US military are spending 22 billion on it.
Piloting drones is a perfectly legit niche use, and is an actual job of actual importance. Battlefield information management doesn't really seem to benefit (they've been trying to make it happen for years with VR sets), and I predict that bit will go exactly nowhere. The US has blown literally trillions of dollars on white elephants before so that should be unsurprising.

I am not claiming that this is the next big thing, or will ever be a thing, but if it became a thing, I could see 3dVTT being useful at that point.
Well yes. I suspect if 3D VTT became a thing it'd be because someone made and sold some kind of holoprojector table really cheaply though.
 

We've got that. It doesn't solve any fundamental issues. The lightest ones aren't cheap but are insanely light but the wealthy people who buy them follow the exact pattern everyone does - 2-6 weeks of "Wow" followed by a few months of "Oh yeah, I guess I could" followed by "Meh, can't be bothered".


Piloting drones is a perfectly legit niche use, and is an actual job of actual importance. Battlefield information management doesn't really seem to benefit (they've been trying to make it happen for years with VR sets), and I predict that bit will go exactly nowhere. The US has blown literally trillions of dollars on white elephants before so that should be unsurprising.
Yes, because it is hard, but I can see the attraction. Modern soldiers lug around a lot of battery and screen weight.
Well yes. I suspect if 3D VTT became a thing it'd be because someone made and sold some kind of holoprojector table really cheaply though.
Well Microsoft demoed 3D virtual projection about 10 or 15 years ago using modified kinect cameras as projectors but I have no idea how it would be made interactable. They never took it any further as far as I know, so they probably could not think of a way either.
 

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