D&D 5E WotC Strixhaven/Kickstarter Red Dawn

[Morrus]

If the game is called Red Dawn then it had better be about commies invading the USA. Wolverines!

Yeah it may well have been this!

 

[Morrus]

Wait? There’s no proof WotC c&d this?
There isn’t a secrecy clause with a C&D is there?

There isn’t. But I guess it’s possible that the C&D threatened further action if they talked about it and they decided that wasn’t a fight they wanted to start.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

There isn’t. But I guess it’s possible that the C&D threatened further action if they talked about it and they decided that wasn’t a fight they wanted to start.

This is possible but it would be highly unusual. Most C&D letters absolutely want to be publicised, at least to some extent, because they want to warn others off too.

It's also hard to see on what basis you could demand the person receiving the letter shut up. There'd be no legit legal basis, so what they'd be saying cease and desist and if you don't also keep the letter secret we'll pursue you even though you ceased and desisted? It's true that some legal letters request confidentiality but it's toothless nonsense.

I can't speak for every US state but in England and Wales and I suspect most of the common law world, any judge seeing action being attempted after a C&D had been complied with, even if the recipient had ignored requests for confidentiality, would be very unhappy indeed.

The usual reason C&D letters get hidden,when they are (which is rare in gaming and media) is that they're embarrassing to the recipient. For example, getting a C&D from the owners of the Red Dawn movie/videogame trademark would be pretty embarrassing, because it was obviously a dumb move to call this Red Dawn.

Equally do we even know they got a C&D? "Circumstances outside our control" doesn't scream C&D to me. It could cover a huge number of things.

 

[Morrus]

This is possible but it would be highly unusual. Most C&D letters absolutely want to be publicised, at least to some extent, because they want to warn others off too.

It's also hard to see on what basis you could demand the person receiving the letter shut up. There'd be no legit legal basis, so what they'd be saying cease and desist and if you don't also keep the letter secret we'll pursue you even though you ceased and desisted? It's true that some legal letters request confidentiality but it's toothless nonsense.

I can't speak for every US state but in England and Wales and I suspect most of the common law world, any judge seeing that would be very unhappy indeed.

The usual reason C&D letters get hidden,when they are (which is rare in gaming and media) is that they're embarrassing to the recipient. For example, getting a C&D from the owners of the Red Dawn movie/videogame trademark would be pretty embarrassing, because it was obviously a dumb move to call this Red Dawn.

Equally do we even know they got a C&D? "Circumstances outside our control" doesn't scream C&D to me. It could cover a huge number of things.

I guess maybe they might say "We believe you have already caused us damage, and we will sue you for those damages. However, if you stop now, and promise not to tell anybody, we will not sue you."

As for why they might do that, I don't know. I guess some companies may want to protect their IP but not appear overly litigious to their fan base?

Dunno. I'm literally just guessing here.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

I guess maybe they might say "We believe you have already caused us damage, and we will sue you for those damages. However, if you stop now, and promise not to tell anybody, we will not sue you."

As for why they might do that, I don't know. I guess some companies may want to protect their IP but not appear overly litigious to their fan base?

Dunno. I'm literally just guessing here.

Yeah I guess based on cases and law I'm aware of (which is largely E&W but other common law nations a bit too) I don't think this would be very effective. I guess if the Red Dawn people refused to pay for competent legal advice maybe they might back off?

I was going to say WotC's legal team wouldn't do something as dumb as that but then I remembered the Dragonlance idiocy, where it appears WotC tried something incredibly dumb, legally-speaking (though I suspect that the individual involved probably avoided speaking to legal, just like Mearls sidestepped them, hence said individual being fired).

 

[Staffan]

They made a follow-up post on the Kickstarter saying "Last week, we were politely warned that because of a few elements within our presentation of the Kickstarter page, legal action was highly likely without a change. We worked with the group who warned us, as well as with legal experts and trusted advisors, and a change was not possible given the deadline of the Kickstarter campaign."

So either Wizards or whomever has the rights to the Red Dawn movie, or possibly a third party saying "Dude, there's no way that's going to get past Wizards' lawyers."

 

[Silvercat Moonpaw]

Based on what I saw on the Kickstarter page, it might be as simple as "we used images instead of text to display everything, so it would take too much work to make even small edits in a limited timeframe".

 

[Ruin Explorer]

They made a follow-up post on the Kickstarter saying "Last week, we were politely warned that because of a few elements within our presentation of the Kickstarter page, legal action was highly likely without a change. We worked with the group who warned us, as well as with legal experts and trusted advisors, and a change was not possible given the deadline of the Kickstarter campaign."

So either Wizards or whomever has the rights to the Red Dawn movie, or possibly a third party saying "Dude, there's no way that's going to get past Wizards' lawyers."

Interesting. Sounds like there was no actual C&D, just a "check yourself before you wreck yourself". The description makes it sound like either yeah it's the Red Dawn people, or if it's WotC their complaint is primarily about trade dress, i.e. that it looks too much like Dark Sun.

I dunno if they've already removed the offending elements but if not as well as looking like Dark Sun, at least one illustration is almost a direct rip from Diablo III of all things.

 

[HammerMan]

this is the first I am hearing of Red Dawn... if they scub a bit I hope they can relaunch with spellcasting monarchs that empower there worshiping soldiers...

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

Harry Potter combines so many existing tropes and ideas from folklore and other works of fiction, there's very little that's original other than how it's all combined. JKR is really good at ripping off or syncretizing other works, depending on how generous you're being, into an accessible whole. If something feels familiar to the world of Harry Potter, chances are it first appeared elsewhere.

Stryxhaven isn't a rip-off of Harry Potter but a WotC version of the trope Wizarding School.

Oh, I do love that movie.

Before Harry Potter was published the worst witch was even an action-live production with Tim Curry.