would this be evil?

[Balgus]

You are in a group with a rogue that like stealing. She wanders off one night before an adv (to make a lil money) and is caught stealing from a high ranking polit figure. You need to get her out of jail by tomorrow in order to go on your way (and will prolly never come back to this town).

So you kidnap the politician's daughter and hold her ransome. While holding her hostage, she wriggles free from the mouthpiece and starts to scream. You hit her with the back of your sword to subdue her, but crits. the DM rules that you hit her so hard that she is bludgeopned to death.

Puting aside that you now have to deal with the law, but was that act evil? was the kidnapping evil? hitting her to shut her up? and what happens now? The adventure hasn't even started yet and we are in a heap of trouble.

If it were up to me- I would get the hell out of Dodge- and roll up new characters. But one of the players put a lot of work into his- and doesn't want to throw it away....

little help...

 

[Rel]

Um, yeah, that's evil alright.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

 

[Mathew_Freeman]

But one of the players put a lot of work into his- and doesn't want to throw it away....

If he put so much work into it, why did he carry on to this point? I'd say that broadly speaking, the kidnapping was certainly unlawful and probably evil because you did it purely for your own gain.

Does the thief player have a history of this sort of thing? If I was you I'd have turned his character over to the authorities and let him live with the consequences of his actions. That type of action (thieving and then suggesting kidnapping to cover himself) is not particularly fun for everyone else if the character continuously gets into trouble and then runs to the other PC's for help.

 

[brak1]

Well, you held an innocent hostage, put her in harm's way and did enough violence to her to kill her - albeit by mistake. Yeeeaaah... I think that's evil. It's why they say the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

As for what you do now... Cripes. That's tough. You could try facing the music, trying to make amends somehow. Someone could trade their life for the life of the girl. (Preferably not the person who put so much work into their character.) Buggin' out is always an option, but you run the risk of the party self-destructing (depending on how much role playing you do).

Regardless, there should be consequences. Whether these are external or internal is up to you and the DM.

 

[Balgus]

Tallarm:
If he put so much work into it, why did he carry on to this point? I'd say that broadly speaking, the kidnapping was certainly unlawful and probably evil because you did it purely for your own gain.

the thief was stealing for her own gain. but the rest of teh group, a cleric, wiz, sorc, ranger and fighter were the ones that kidnapped the girl. We just thought it was the easiest way to get on with the game. Guess not.

Does the thief player have a history of this sort of thing? If I was you I'd have turned his character over to the authorities and let him live with the consequences of his actions. That type of action (thieving and then suggesting kidnapping to cover himself) is not particularly fun for everyone else if the character continuously gets into trouble and then runs to the other PC's for help.

we just started the game- first adventure- all lvl 1. in her history- yes she loves to steal. She was in jail tho- and so the kidnapping was our idea- actually it was the ranger's idea. but we all had a hand in planning it.

The DM got a kik out of it too. He said it would have been easier just to plead for her. eh- you learn something everyday....

edit:
and the ranger was the one that put a lot of work into his char. he was a tough guy that was left in the woods by his parents when he was little. They were running away from a band of hobgoblins and hid him so that they could draw the band away. they were killed, and he was left with an amulet that was special to that village. He went to a mystic (shaman)to get his past figured out.

 

[LostSoul]

It's evil, but not super-evil. I think it's one of those things that could provide great role-playing opportuinites. Lots of angst and all that jazz.

I don't think the character would change alignment because of this. (Well, maybe to Neutral from Good.)

 

[Lazybones]

Fat Tony: What if your family was starving. Would it be wrong to steal bread for them?
Bart: No.
Fat Tony: And what if you had a very large family. Would it be wrong to steal a truckload of bread for them?
Bart: I guess not.
Fat Tony: What if your family doesn't like bread? What if they like... cigarettes? Would it be wrong to steal for them then?
Bart: Hell no!
Fat Tony: Enjoy the gift.


Oh, and regarding the original question: yup, you got yerself an evil party there, mister. I'd run with it, though; you can have fun running from the law for the rest of your admittedly short (assuming the politician has money and power) lives.

 

[Sejs]

it's lower-case evil. The diet coke of evil. It's not alignment-change evil, but it probably is slap-on-the-wrist-from-your-god kind of evil for those clerics in the party if they worship a good god. Like all your 5th+ spell slots are full of ATONE spells for some reason and all your dX spells (3d8 heals, for instance) come up as the minumum result. Paladins may lose status~ kidnapping could feasably be justified but nabbing the mayor's daughter because your stupid ass klepto friend gets an itch sure isn't.

the 'bludgeoned to death' thing was a bad call on your DMs part, btw.

 

[Gizzard]

Pretty much everything you mention is evil, but more than that, its unlawful. Even in a town without much law, you can bet that the one thing that will get you hung is messing with powerful political figures.

I dont get why you all have to roll up new characters though. Now that you are generally evil, it shouldnt be a hard decision to get the heck out of the town and let the thief pay for your crimes.

Tangent: Alignment is a hard thing; always the subject of a lengthy debate. But if I were DMing your group, I'd be counting up your evil acts vs. your good acts to see how you weigh in the balance. From what you mentioned, you'd be headed rapidly towards NE.

Tangent 2: In a lot of modern countries killing someone during the commission of a crime counts as premeditated murder I believe. So its treated very seriously. In a medeaval society they'd probably hang you for the kidnapping alone, so you dont have to worry about things getting worse than they already are. ;-)

 

[Darkness]

Is it feasible to raise the slain daughter?

BTW, if you can't pay for it, you could just kidnap the relative of a high priest and force him... Ah, well - maybe not.

Also, and regardless of whether somebody already knows that she's dead, you could try to get some creature with shape-changing powers (e.g., an erinyes) to look like her and still arrange an exchange.
Be careful, though; the chances aren't too good...