Would you give XP for this?

[Chacal]

UIh, making the DM smile is worth some Xps? Wanna play in that group!

Of course it is ! But it isn't a fixed (and big) amount I warn you We play to have fun.
Even If i Try hard, I always give better grades to students when I'm happy. I know that giving XP is not the same thing, but
when I'm evaluating fuzzy things like interpretation/cleverness or whatever, my (and I dare hope yours ) current state of mind comes into play.

BTW , there some RPG where fun is rewarded by a fixed amount of XP, but it tends to become artificial.

Chacal

P.S I agree with Firelance on contagion (the part where it's said to be usefull, not the one where it should give xp to paladins )

 

[Drawmack]

What are XP?
They are experience points.

What is an experience?
www.dictionary.com defines experience as

1) The apprehension of an object, thought, or emotion through the senses or mind: a child's first experience of snow.

2)
a. Active participation in events or activities, leading to the accumulation of knowledge or skill: a lesson taught by experience; a carpenter with experience in roof repair.
b. The knowledge or skill so derived.

3)
a. An event or a series of events participated in or lived through.
b. The totality of such events in the past of an individual or group.

So when questioning awarding experience points the only fair questin is was this an experience for the character?
If it fits any or all of the above definitions then it is an experience and deserves experience points.

Does the paladin walking through the traps have an experience?
Definition 1: I would say that yes the paladin has this. Maybe he's walking down the hallway and the first trap goes off, he doesn't get hurt but he might next time and is therefor more apprehensive.

Definition 2a: Yes, the character triggered the traps and has gained the knowledge that he shouldn't go dungeon delving alone because next time the traps might hurt.

Definition 2b: Yes, but it will always agree with 2a

Definition 3a: He set of three traps, each creating an experience that he lived through correct? Then yup he had an experience.

Definition 3b: Life reaching and therefor barred from discussion of a sigular event.

The encouters with the traps meet every criteria of an experience and you're saying that he doesn't get experience points? That doesn't make any sense.

The guy gets experience points for surviving the experience of the traps.

NOTE: I am not saying he deserves full experience simply that he deserves some experience. What I would probably do is calculate the amount of experience he would have gotten as part of his original party and award that to him. i.e. Party Size/xp

Here is a fictional transcript of me and my dm if I was the paladin:

DM: You don't get any experience for the traps because they stood no chance to harm you.

Me: The rest of the party doesn't get resurected because realizing how foolish I was to take a class with immunities I commit suicide.

DM: You're character would never do that.

Me: He is and on top of that I vote that you're not longer the DM because if you weren't going to award experiece because my abilities negated the traps abilities then you should have changed the abilities of the traps on the fly. You're a crappy DM who just shafted my character.

DM: Woa wait a minute.

Me: All the other idiots died but I lived so I get no XP for the traps but if they lived I would have gotten XP right.

DM: Well, yeah

Me: So for being the superior character you are penalizing me because of class abilities.

DM: I'm not penalizing you

Me: I jab my sword through my throat everyone roll new characters and I'll DM from here on out.

 

[Stalker0]

Next thing your going to start cutting out xp from the ranger who happens to have +5 damage against demons, or the fighter against monsters because they are now easier for him. Or heck, just having a cleric makes things a whole lot easier with healing.

The whole thing about raising or lowering xp based on encounters should be an external thing. If orcs are behind cover, that's a tougher encounter. If the party has lost its weapons for whatever reason and fights something, that's a tougher encounter. If the party fights some guy who uses a lot of fear spells, and the party has a paladin, that's the DM giving the paladin a chance to shine, its not an "easier encounter"

So I would give the paladin xp for those traps. And even more, let's say that the paladin lost his immunity to fear for a while for whatever rp reason you can think of and he hits a fear trap. I would give him even more xp than normal. Why? Because that's an unusually difficult challenge for a man who is normally immune to fear. Hell, just the rp aspects of a paladin having to deal with fear would be worth the xp.

 

[Chacal]

What are XP?
They are experience points.

What is an experience?
<snip>
The guy gets experience points for surviving the experience of the traps.

Unless it was the first time he saw a trap, and has an epiphany like " Oh my god , I should watch my steps" There is no survival involved in the situation.

Experience, as defined in a dictionary,
doesn't take into account classes of experience, for instance , an experience that might raise an expert level can amount to nothing for a paladin.

Here is a fictional transcript of me and my dm if I was the paladin:

DM: You don't get any experience for the traps because they stood no chance to harm you.

This supposes that your DM tells you the exact amount of XP you get for every action during a game. I expect this for a CRPG, but it's not the way I've ever seen played in my limited experience. YMMV and this difference in point of view is probably the very core of our disagreement.

Me: The rest of the party doesn't get resurected because realizing how foolish I was to take a class with immunities I commit suicide.

I didn't heard such a childish statement since I start gaming (hey the 12 year old boys we were could have done that)

Me: He is and on top of that I vote that you're not longer the DM because if you weren't going to award experiece because my abilities negated the traps abilities then you should have changed the abilities of the traps on the fly. You're a crappy DM who just shafted my character.

How much drama for a handful of XP for a Trap

Me: All the other idiots died but I lived so I get no XP for the traps but if they lived I would have gotten XP right.

DM: Well, yeah

The DM isn't defending himself very well, let's play the game :
"DM : Well, if they were alive , and these traps hurting them would have made the situation difficult for you cause you would have to deal with fleeing comrades or possible contamination, yes you would have.

Me: So for being the superior character you are penalizing me because of class abilities.

There's no such thing as a superior character. Not being challenged is not a penality.

Me :I jab my sword through my throat everyone roll new characters and I'll DM from here on out.

In a group like the one I'm used to play, you'll get booted. I never played in a group in which such situation could be aproved by the group. if it had been the case, I would have left the group without remorse.


I guess This is just telling us once more that there are very different way to play D&D.



Chacal

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Darklone, could you edit that so it says "Archer and very stupid monster ..."

Maitre D

Doesn't have to be. It just has to be unable to leave that position, and unable to fight back (no ranged attacks). Even the smartest character will know then that he's boned, and will be equally unable to do something against it...

 

[Chacal]

Next thing your going to start cutting out xp from the ranger who happens to have +5 damage against demons, or the fighter against monsters because they are now easier for him. Or heck, just having a cleric makes things a whole lot easier with healing.

Where did someone said that easier means 0 xp ? I've just seen 0 challenge = 0 xp.


ChacalP.S the fun part is, I'm usually generous with XP (Not so for magic items though)

 

[Pielorinho]

In a group like the one I'm used to play, you'll get booted. I never played in a group in which such situation could be aproved by the group. if it had been the case, I would have left the group without remorse.
Chacal

I totally agree, and hope that Drawmack is exaggerating for the sake of making a point (even if the point is that he's one crazy badass ).

Nonetheless, I think my description of how the experience would benefit the paladin's faith is wholly sufficient for explaining why a paladin would gain experience from the situation. Indeed, it's a little bit weird that if a paladin hung back in the party while the rogue successfully disarmed the trap, the paladin would gain more experience than if the paladin walked through the traps, protected by the mantle of his faith.

One last point: I'm guessing this isn't a huge amount of experience we're talking about, right? If so, why fret over it? If the player wants the experience, and there's a reasonably good case to make for his getting it, give it to him.

(I may be misreading you: it may be that the player is unaware of the potential for experience here, and you're just being uber-cautious, soliciting other opinions before deciding on XP awards. If so, ignore the last paragraph).

Daniel

 

[Forrester]

Me: He is and on top of that I vote that you're not longer the DM because if you weren't going to award experiece because my abilities negated the traps abilities then you should have changed the abilities of the traps on the fly. You're a crappy DM who just shafted my character.

DM: Woa wait a minute.

Me: All the other idiots died but I lived so I get no XP for the traps but if they lived I would have gotten XP right.

DM: Well, yeah

Me: So for being the superior character you are penalizing me because of class abilities.

DM: I'm not penalizing you

Me: I jab my sword through my throat everyone roll new characters and I'll DM from here on out.

Your name isn't "Bob", is it? I like the part about you jabbing your sword through your throat, though.

 

[Drawmack]

No my name is Tom.

The conversation was exagerated, the point I was making was that I would not tollerate my character not getting XP because of class abilities.

Granted the hypothetical conversation hinges on the player knowing he didn't get xp awarded. Normally this would not be the situation. I took the liberty for the sake of the point.

I personally believe that any experience the character goes through awards xp. I've even redone the xp chart so that a 20 lvl character still gets xp for fighting a 1st lvl enoer. Of course it's like 5 xp but it's something.

As I said I wouldn't give the paladin full xp, I am not arguing on decreasing the xp. I even put forth what I would do is just award him, his part of the xp the entire group would have gotten.

Okay, he is immune and those immunities are in effect all the time so you're saying that the character did not suffer a challenge and therefor does not gain experience.

The character did have an experience though, even if it was not challenging and that experience should net them some xp. Even if it's just a 1 point token it is something to symbolize that they went through the traps.

 

[hammymchamham]

if a mid level gold-half dragon fought a mid level Elemental Savant: Fire who just happened to have only fire spells that day, would the half dragon get XP?