+X Items: Sacred Cow or Holy Burger?

[Nebulous]

What I don't like is that dnd has already factored the effects of a +X weapon into the game. Now, you are expected to have a +X weapon by a certain point in the game, because the game assumes you will have one and has increased the monster's stats accordingly to accomodate this. Kinda defeats the point of having the weapon, IMO. Makes acquiring them more of a chore than an accomplishment to be celebrated.

Agreed. It takes some DM finagling with monster stats to make them appropriate for the PC level if you decide to mess with the magic item ratio "per the book." Not that it's terribly hard to do, but there's room for error.

It's the catch 22 of 4e; the perfect balance makes for a smoother game so long as the boat isn't rocked, cause then everyone gets dumped in deep water.

 

[Drkfathr1]

Turn all magic weapons/armor into covenant weapons/armor. The longer you keep them, they gain more plusses and powers. Magic items are even MORE rare in a campaign like this because no one has an incentive to sell their stuff.
That's what i'm doing in my campaign, giving weapons names and history and the characters feel more attached to it. Destroying a weapon or stealing it in this regard can be a huge blow to them (and THEN they can find a replacement of equivalent level).

It also solves the problem of having to stat up a monster with a +4 triple flail.

This.

That's what I'm doing in my campaign. Items with the +'s scale with the level of the character using them. That way magic weapons, armor, etc don't become disposable tools to be discarded or sold off every few levels. Now players can have signature items they keep throughout their whole career. Plus they can always get minor additional enchantments added to their existing items from time to time.

Also helps solve the whole "can we go buy some magic stuff?"

 

[Hellzon]

Voted "They should go away".

They don't even have to go all away. There's still room for level-independent +1 weapons even in a carefully balanced system. +1 to hit scales just as well from a weapon as from a feat. Just call it "X of accuracy" and throw it in with the other enchantments like flaming, vorpal, etc.

 

[Nymrohd]

I don't like them much. D&D can keep them but give players enhancement thresholds like NPCs have. In my game everyone get an automatic enhancement bonus to the big three regardless of what item he uses per the DMG item threshold rule (+1 at 6-10 to +5 at 26-30).

Agree completely that they are the main reason for the ridiculous item prices which mean that selling a lvl 30 item should be enough to buy a small kingdom and force players to give up on great items they love (and may have great campaign meaning) for a higher level item. Also getting rid of the pluses let's you make weapon/armor/neck slot items fewer on the course of the campaign and allows for more magic items of other kinds on treasure parcels without screwing the math.

 

[Lord Xtheth]

I've always been kind of a stingy DM.
I've never liked TV a treasure, ever! I've always liked my players going through this game by the skin of their teeth. This doesn't mean I don't give out treasure, this means I'd try to find ways to give the players something else to look forward to.
For instance: instead of handing out a +1 sword, I would much rather hand out a one use portion that gives the PC up bonus that lasts for an encounter instead of a permanent bonus.

 

[ExploderWizard]

+X items were never much of a problem as long as they were treated as magic items rather than gear. Once you have a system that assumes +X items at a given level and design the whole system around a character needing these items (and for them to keep increasing in + on sort of fixed schedule) then they kind of become a pain to manage.

 

[Tuft]

What I don't like is that dnd has already factored the effects of a +X weapon into the game. Now, you are expected to have a +X weapon by a certain point in the game, because the game assumes you will have one and has increased the monster's stats accordingly to accomodate this. Kinda defeats the point of having the weapon, IMO. Makes acquiring them more of a chore than an accomplishment to be celebrated.

Agreed. The "side effect" can be something that feels like a bonus or an opportunity to customize the character, but the plus is just something you tick off a to-do list.

 

[roguerouge]

Why can't you just let players improve the items they have again, making them signature items? I don't see why you have to have players find all this L00t in the first place. It's a really simple hack to say, adjust your items to the PC wealth. Then you toss in the rare find, sending the signal that heroes make items special, not crafting.

 

[TerraDave]

If you took them away...they would come back. Its just to handy a concept, and when you have say that +2 sword you use all the time, you really notice the benefit, versus "cooler" powers that can be used so iregularly they may be forgotten!

But the magic item arms race can be annoying, and has been an issue in the game for decades. Knowing some items will be traded away later, and allowing key items to be upgraded, is a straight forward enough solution.

 

[Mouseferatu]

They don't even have to go all away. There's still room for level-independent +1 weapons even in a carefully balanced system. +1 to hit scales just as well from a weapon as from a feat. Just call it "X of accuracy" and throw it in with the other enchantments like flaming, vorpal, etc.

I have no idea why nobody (that I know of) has thought of this before. This is brilliant. I'd love to see the game go this route, where "accuracy" (or whatever) is just another property that magic weapons can have, and otherwise the notion of "+X" goes away to be replaced by more interesting properties.