Yet another solution to the Minion Problem

[Garthanos]

lol ^

I would not press any of those links.... just warning the general public.

good lord does we have us a bot in our midst.

 

[Emryys]

2. Increase minion hp and require that you do at least that much damage to kill them or not at all (problem: It's hard to reliably pick a hp level that "works")

Minion HP = Minion Level or ML x2

3. Require two hits to kill a minion (problem: bookkeeping, slows combat)

Small book keeping... fine or bloodied

I'd mix it up so some are regular minions, other's aren't... give the controllers fits...

 

[CapnZapp]

I would be careful giving hp to minions. Chances are, a few hp only means added administration, and that any form of attack kills them anyway.

I like the "resist 5/10/15" idea much better. Simpler, faster, and a much bigger nerf of autodamage than the controller's bursts.

IMO, the ease with which characters can blast minions to death, is intentional and functional and should not be nerfed.

What needs to be nerfed is instead how even a single point of autodamage kills any minion; as well as the high xp awards minions yield.

 

[Garthanos]

Minion HP = Minion Level or ML x2



Small book keeping... fine or bloodied

I'd mix it up so some are regular minions, other's aren't... give the controllers fits...

Some of them minions are pre-bloodied... done deal.

 

[eriktheguy]

Auto hit abilities bloody minions instead of killing
Minion level in damage from one source always kills
Attacks that hit always kill minions

If you find all the minions go down on the first round, ask the players if they enjoy it. If they do, don't change it (maybe count minions as less XP if you need a challenge). If they don't enjoy it, trickle minions. Introduce a few each round so that they can't all be killed at once. I sometimes have minions respawn endlessly until a condition is met (leader killed, signal fire put out).

I don't recommend giving them a defense bonus, but if you do, controllers should ignore it.

If you find the controller is destroying 6 minions in 1 round easily, don't fret, controllers are less powerful than other classes in many ways (imo) so let them shine.

 

[Flipguarder]

I would be careful giving hp to minions. Chances are, a few hp only means added administration,

When I think of the administration required for 4e it reminds me of a simpsons clip I couldn't find. But here's the general screenplay section.

Lisa's rival: Hey Dad, let's play anagram description. ______(some long name)

Lisa's rival's dad: _____ (witty comment using the same letters in the name that describes the person). Here lisa you try. We give you a name, and you make an anagram phrase describing the person. Try this one ______

Lisa: Umm.... ______ (not really anything witty or even related to the person)

Lisa's rival's dad: That's ok... Here's a ball. It bounces. You can bounce it.

point being, that extra amounts of bookeeping are REALLY not that hard in 4e. It got ridiculous in previous versions, but adding 30 or so hp to each minion isn't all that hard.

 

[Garthanos]

I took that clip as you expressed it to mean there are different forms of intelligence and that people specialize according to there natures.... and therefore measuring it according to your own standards is doomed to make errors... sometimes severe ones of self deception.

umm perhaps I didnt get it... putting hit points on minions is for me contrary to there philosophy allowing them to be bloodied and intimidateable or healable is (cool). and using more strategically instead of as insta-clump instakills makes sense...

But I dont "like" tracking hit points (on significant creatures I do it as a necessary evil) but on minions? lets just say that one less set of numbers to think about... one less ball I need to bounce ... not because its hard but because Im not into basketball.. prefer soccer or trackball

 

[Henrix]

I'll reiterate my version, which works really well, in my experience.

• All minions get +2 to all defences, putting them on par with others at their level.
• Minions get a save against all damage that does not entail an attack roll against the minion in question. (Including stuff like Cleave, that require an attack roll against another minion but deals automatic damage against another (who now gets a save).)

This means that there is still no bookkeeping, which I think is really essential.
Area attacks are still effective. If it's one that does automatic damage (which is generally quite low) it kills about half of the minions in the area.
There is no such thing as certain death - the PCs cannot ever be absolutely certain that they'll get a minion out of the way.
It's simple and easy to remember, and requires no extra prep - just remember to add two and roll those saves.

 

[Flipguarder]

umm perhaps I didnt get it...

No... maybe i didn't make it clear enough. I feel like the amount of bookeeping required in 3.5 got ridiculous. But I feel as though there is a wide berth between what 4.0 has now, and what I can keep track of. I have a much harder time dealing with conditions than anything.

Hey in any reasonable encounter, you can't do without using at least one piece of paper and one pen (pencil). As long as that remains true and I can write everything I need to without disrupting the flow of battle, then I see no problem. Giving minions some hp doesn't prevent me from doing that.

 

[Minigiant]

I simply do.
Minions only takes damage on attack roll with a natural roll of 13 vs AC or 11 vs non AC.

But only if there's more than 3 minions.