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You're a villain. How would you change the world? Contest with prizes. (Spoilers for ZEITGEIST)

Which factions' plots do you support?


  • Total voters
    85
  • Poll closed .

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aglondier

Explorer
Miller's Pyre, Moral Mind, Materialists.

I love the idea of the "good guys" winning...and getting exactly what they asked for, a regime so terrifyingly good and moral and right that they cannot exist within it. I would also include the Moral Mind/Materialists because magic/superstition/religion are the cause of many of the worlds woes...and pretty much the only threat to the coming world order.
 

DonTadow

First Post
I voted for Materialists and Moral Minded, to me they both mean the same thing.

Analyzing the campaign, I would think that the organization's goals are grand in scope and life changing. Two of the "head" members were greatly effected by magic, the victim of magic twisted to destroy a god and curse an entire nation. The third lives forever from body to body. We don't know if this is a curse or not. I can imagine that as the industrial age is ushering in, magic is still a thorn in the side of progression. If we eliminate magic, we put the world on one accord and set a course for its future, a normal nonmagical world.
 

gideonpepys

Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.
I voted for Materialists and Moral Minded, to me they both mean the same thing.
Unless I'm mistaken, you haven't picked a major faction yet. Might I humbly suggest that your choices and your reasoning lend themselves to a vote for Miller's Pyre?
 

Will Doyle

Explorer
The Arboretum - Command the Green. Harness it like steel.
Weapon Mongers - Unleash the fungal spores!
Nationalists - Purge our enemies like weeds, and seed our empire from the ruins.
 

Ajar

Explorer
“The Pyre, while a noble ideal, is fundamentally flawed.” The cutting voice seems at odds with the speaker, a rotund woman with soft features.

“Jiese, the plane of fire, carries the aspect of Cunning. It is this aspect that drives the gears of industry -- the gears of revolution! The Pyre would replace Cunning with Expression, enhancing our understanding of others’ motivations. Combined with their other changes, it would be far easier for groups of sentient beings to come to consensus.

“As I said, a noble ideal! But what of the cost? The loss of Cunning means the loss of progress, invention, technology. Consensus would lead to stagnation! Perhaps this would suit some within the Watchmakers: a form of social utopia where everyone agrees with everyone else, and no new ideas are promulgated. I doubt this is what the Pyre’s advocates intend, and perhaps it is an extreme vision, but we cannot risk the loss of industry! That would bind us forever to the earth, forgoing the possibilities of flight, or of planar travel. While replacing Apet as the Pyre plans would bring us closer to other planes, the preservation of Nem would still prevent us from exploring what lies beyond.

“I see many unfamiliar faces here, a sign that our group’s distributed structure is an effective one. I am Dame Constance Baden, scholar and scientist, and I speak for the Sky League. We in the Sky League have allied ourselves with the Trekkers, those who wish to voyage beyond the realms currently known to us. We stand ready to throw our weight behind a major faction that welcomes our ideals.

“Jiese must be preserved: on this, I think all factions that favour progress and industry over stagnant isolation can agree. Further, tampering with Reida is too great a risk. We are willing to partner with factions that will leave both Jiese and Reida untouched.

“The planes that must be replaced are Avilona and Nem. Avilona’s Calm trait discourages progress, and replacing it would finally unshackle Jiese’s Cunning! Moreover, associating Calm with the Plane of Air prevents flight, grounding us and forcing us to travel by boat or train. But if this Calm trait is replaced, there is an opportunity to craft great vessels that will carry us to the skies!

“I have designed just such a vessel. I call it... the ZEPPELIN!

“A functioning model has been constructed, and even as I speak now it is floating above the ground of our pocket plane. Please observe it at your leisure.

“Meanwhile, Nem locks us away from the world. Imagine what lands we might find beyond the seals? What we might learn? Naturally, there are risks, but eternal isolation would be a far greater threat to our civilization. With proper defences, the risks of extraplanar invasion can be mitigated. And we need not become the world’s overlords, as Colossus suggests – with Cunning unshackled, our technology would be our defence! Some of you may have heard of the strange beasts sighted at the Kaybeau Exposition in Flint. How could such creatures hope to stand against the ZEPPELIN?

“We would also support replacing Urim, Apet and Mavisha, but this is not essential. Mavisha’s Mystery trait is an impediment to progress, but it is less severe than Calm. Teleportation magic is also less important in a land where flight is possible. And finally, Apet’s distance property could be part of a reasonable defence against extraplanar invasion once Nem is replaced.

“If the Pyre, Colossus, Arboretum, or Panarchists are willing to revise their plans to accommodate us, we will gladly assist with the planar alignment calculations.”
 

As a supporter to the Panarchist Cause I have to say that i find interesting to see that wonderful flying machine made! so i will support the sky league. Conquering the sky will be the ultimate form of freedom and we, the Panarchist believe above all on freedom.

I'm making a call on my friends of the Miller Pyre to stop the plans of the Watchmakers and join our group in search of a future with no Gods, No Countries, No Kings. Just living beings freely deciding how to rule their lives!
 

gideonpepys

Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.
“If the Pyre, Colossus, Arboretum, or Panarchists are willing to revise their plans to accommodate us, we will gladly assist with the planar alignment calculations.”

Miller's Pyre is the most readily able to accommodate your needs, as our plan has a spare plane. Consider it done. If your vote goes for the Pyre, I would certainly vote for the Sky League - that was, in fact my original vote!

I'm making a call on my friends of the Miller Pyre to stop the plans of the Watchmakers and join our group in search of a future with no Gods, No Countries, No Kings. Just living beings freely deciding how to rule their lives!
We might very well call upon you to do just the same!
 

gideonpepys

Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.
“If the Pyre, Colossus, Arboretum, or Panarchists are willing to revise their plans to accommodate us, we will gladly assist with the planar alignment calculations.”

Miller's Pyre is the most readily able to accommodate your needs, as our plan has a spare plane. Consider it done. If your vote goes for the Pyre, I would certainly vote for the Sky League - that was, in fact my original vote!

I'm making a call on my friends of the Miller Pyre to stop the plans of the Watchmakers and join our group in search of a future with no Gods, No Countries, No Kings. Just living beings freely deciding how to rule their lives!
We might very well call upon you to do just the same! In fact, your vote is slightly lower than ours right now, so the switch would be more profitable.
 

Shilubi

First Post
My heartily thanks to all of you discussing about our grand plan.

It has been refeshing, and the support gathered to the Watchmaker's plan has given us voice and weight.


But then, what else?

People are now reviewing the smaller trends, among which the popular Moral Mind.
To those supporting this cause, i will say this:
Do you really think that rationality will make a better world?
Moral is about what you believe in and/or what you think, take the belief out of the picture, you will still be left with some bad apples, thinking bad apples.
I still remember when the name for this cause was the Mortal Mind, and that was far more accurate.

Still, not bad per se. But if you support the Mortal Mind as your only plan for the future, you are only promoting your hate against faith.
I say that means you don't mind about the future,
I say this is not a moral choice, despite the name.

The Long Now is popular too.
And i do understand your plan. There is high hope that long term thinking will lead to more responsible behaviors.
Not my choice, but a very good one.

IF you want to support other ideas, consider beauty and wonder.
Art is creation, walking hand in hand with science and morality to define what we are as living beings.
Many of those creations are beautiful expressions of our longings, our lives, our souls.
And wonder is pure glee, making you more alive than ever.
Flying, whatever the means, would be without doubts truly wonderful.
Those are subtle nudges promoting a more vibrant world.
You'll find those two supporting the Bards and the Sky League.

About the Sky League, a few words of warning:
I heard some people, claiming the Sky League would like nothing more than to lead sky ships to other worlds, putting down the barriers that protected us from far planes.
They are eager to trade votes, even with Miller's doctrine they are rebuking.
Those highly ethical people don't speak for the whole Sky League. As a whole, the Sky League just want to be able to fly.
 

Ajar

Explorer
"To the Watchmakers, I say that I see little use for flight in a world without free will. The essence of the alliance between our faction of Sky Leaguers and Trekkers is liberty! How can an explorer function without free will? How can they respond to the wonders they find on their travels, if they cannot make decisions for themselves?"

Miller's Pyre is the most readily able to accommodate your needs, as our plan has a spare plane. Consider it done. If your vote goes for the Pyre, I would certainly vote for the Sky League - that was, in fact my original vote!
"Ah, but it isn't so simple. The careful replacement of Avilona and Jiese with a binary world is the key to your plan, and we will not countenance the loss of Jiese. More would be required than simply giving your spare plane the trait of Flight. Recalculation of your planar alignments would be necessary to determine if your binary alignment can be accomplished with Nem rather than with Jiese."

"However, the Panarchists could potentially accomodate us more easily. An additional realignment would be needed, but it would not replace any of their existing realignments. To work with the Panarchists, we would ask that they add Avilona to their existing plan, replacing it with a full-fledged Plane of Air carrying the aspect of Flight. Some might argue that with teleportation freely available, flight would be unnecessary, but I must disagree. We believe that flight is necessary in order to reach distant worlds and planes, even with teleportation."

(@RangerWickett -- before we DMs get too far ahead of ourselves, is it even possible for factions to tweak their planar alignments in this way?)

(So far, I've only voted for the Sky League and Trekkers. I'm reserving my main faction vote for now. I might also make a Devil's Advocate post calling for the world to end...)
 

lol @ world ending

Sure, feel free to get into the details of the setting and suggest changes. By the way, I need to ask Russ to post about this on the front page again, since we have another 12 days to go and voting has slowed a bit.
 

Really, people voting for Colossus or Watchmakers didn't find it absolutely cliché? After playing such an original adventure path it would be a waste to ruin it with the conspiracy pursuing two of the most typical evil guy plan (Become super powerful or gain control of everything).
 

gideonpepys

Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.
Really, people voting for Colossus or Watchmakers didn't find it absolutely cliché? After playing such an original adventure path it would be a waste to ruin it with the conspiracy pursuing two of the most typical evil guy plan (Become super powerful or gain control of everything).
These are my sentiments exactly. (Which is why I'm so surprised to find RangerWickett casting his lot in with the Colossus faction.) A good-intentioned plot that goes wrong is more nuanced and interesting imho. But my vote is for Miller's Pyre.
 

Strategic voting, my friend.

Also, as the author, I'm struck by how difficult it will be to motivate adventuring parties if they agree with the bad guys.
 

gideonpepys

Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.
Strategic voting, my friend.

Also, as the author, I'm struck by how difficult it will be to motivate adventuring parties if they agree with the bad guys.
Surely that's the challenge?

These guys wanted to screw with the universe so badly they lost sight of the fact that the ends did not justify the means. Having messed up their grand scheme, they then move to persist with it, and maybe at that point a different faction takes over. But 'rule the world' Bond Villainy is so 2012, don't you think?
 

Strategic voting, my friend.

Also, as the author, I'm struck by how difficult it will be to motivate adventuring parties if they agree with the bad guys.
That's why Miller's Pyre is a bad choice, it's to Good and to close of the original desire of Miller which as we can see on the campaing guide has twisted with the passing of time. Panarchists on the other hand have the adequate mix of surprise element and unexpected consequences.
Anyway what i would like to see it the Moral Mind in effect because that is at the core of the Obscurati Origin.
 

Ajar

Explorer
I see that Hitomi has cast one of his secondary votes to the Sky League. Accordingly, I have cast my primary vote for the Panarchists. So I voted for Panarchists + Sky League + Trekkers, with Avilona's replacement added to the Panarchists' existing plan in order to make flight possible.

I think it makes a lot of sense, and in particular I think Nicodemus would be supportive of the Panarchist concept. While Nicodemus and the ghost council have little faith in common folk, Panarchism allows him to appear compassionate while actually setting up a meritocracy that could, ultimately, lead to Colossus-style rulership for those who rise to the top. A sort of steampunk corporatism.

That said, none of the factions I voted for are currently leading, so I guess my advocacy thus far hasn't been super successful. Perhaps we need some sort of Panarchist-Pyre hybrid to forestall Colossus or Watchmaker. The planar realignments of Panarchist and Pyre are not incompatible, although I still wouldn't vote for a plan that would replace Jiese. Taking industry away from Lanjyr gives you every other fantasy world where they sit at the same tech level for thousands and thousands of years.
 

parhadokzal

Villager
I had initially voted for Miller's, but thought to myself that my players (as I know them) would literrally want to rally the conspiracy. So I changed to Colossus, but I agree that my players would be disappointed that such a complex, shades of grey campaign would end with such a classical "dominate the world because I know better" scheme.
So, my main vote finally goes to Panarchists, which I think is both original and complex, while being something my players would, begrudgingly, impose out of rational thought. (i.e. We can't trust individuals with that kind of powers)
 

gideonpepys

Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain.
That's why Miller's Pyre is a bad choice, it's to Good and to close of the original desire of Miller which as we can see on the campaing guide has twisted with the passing of time.
First of all, who's to say Miller is going to do what the conspiracy says? I know that's what the campaign guide says, but he's not openly expressing that, is he? (How many people even know who he is?) And if this is all about Miller as he is now (as opposed to when he developed his forward-thinking ideology), why is there even a vote? My take on it is that Miller needs the support of the conspiracy he leads, but will fix things the way he (and I) want them fixed in the end.

I had initially voted for Miller's, but thought to myself that my players (as I know them) would literrally want to rally the conspiracy. So I changed to Colossus, but I agree that my players would be disappointed that such a complex, shades of grey campaign would end with such a classical "dominate the world because I know better" scheme.
So, my main vote finally goes to Panarchists, which I think is both original and complex, while being something my players would, begrudgingly, impose out of rational thought. (i.e. We can't trust individuals with that kind of powers)
I'm almost in agreement with you here, but we need to remember that there are wheels within wheels. Who says the Ob leadership goes with what the conclave votes for? Also, the Obscurati plan fails and, above all, the ends do not justify the means. But if the players found themselves in the strange position of bringing the villains to justice and then, ultimately, enacting their 'villainous' plan themselves, wouldn't that be a fabulous end to a campaign?
 

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