Zak Smith is suing his accusers

[Arnwolf666]

Calm down, dude, no one's accusing you of anything.

This thread has gotten way off track.

Why not tell the person that said I was either a coward or had a guilty conscience to calm down.

 

[generic]

Why not tell the person that said I was either a coward or had a guilty conscience to calm down.

I understand that you're upset, and perhaps what @cmad1977 said was the proverbial "last straw", but what you should understand is that no one really thinks that you're committing awful crimes.

Just calm down, and please don't derail the thread with such petty arguments.

 

[Gradine]

This thread has gotten way off track.

Funny how that happened

 

[generic]

Funny how that happened

It was kind of destined for that from the beginning, wasn't it?

 

[MGibster]

If you are accused of sexual harassment at work, you will probably lose your job, even though there is no court case. If an artist makes racist statements, people will stop buying their albums, even though there were no court case.

With any luck, the employer will actually investigate and only terminate the accused when a preponderance of evidence suggest he or she has been sexually harassing others. What's a preponderance of evidence? 50% plus a feather. But you're right, there's no court case. And why should there be? We're not talking criminal charges which is where we get the whole idea of innocent until proven guilty.

 

[Bohandas]

So people are never falsely accused. If one of accused it must be true. Is that what you are saying?

That's certainly the way people seem to be thinking. The whole movement in general gives me an unshakable vibe that reminds me of when I read The Crucible back in highschool

EDIT:

"Is the accuser always holy now? Were they born this morning as clean as God’s fingers? I’ll tell you what’s walking Salem - vengeance is walking Salem. We are what we always were in Salem, but now the little crazy children are jangling the keys of the kingdom, and common vengeance writes the law! This warrant is vengeance! I’ll not give my wife to vengeance!" -from The Crucible

EDIT:

It also reminds me of McCarthyism and of the 1980s/1990's satanic panic witch trials (the McMartin case the Wee Care case, etc)

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

Of course, McCarthy's list proved to be pretty much bogus; and the witch trials and satanic panics were predicated on mythical nonsense.

Sexual misconduct, on the other hand, is a real thing and quite widespread.

 

[billd91]

That's certainly the way people seem to be thinking. The whole movement in general gives me an unshakable vibe that reminds me of when I read The Crucible back in highschool

EDIT:

"Is the accuser always holy now? Were they born this morning as clean as God’s fingers? I’ll tell you what’s walking Salem - vengeance is walking Salem. We are what we always were in Salem, but now the little crazy children are jangling the keys of the kingdom, and common vengeance writes the law! This warrant is vengeance! I’ll not give my wife to vengeance!" -from The Crucible

EDIT:

It also reminds me of McCarthyism and of the 1980s/1990's satanic panic witch trials (the McMartin case the Wee Care case, etc)

McCarthyism (and thus The Crucible) were about persecuting people for political beliefs and associations in a supposedly free society, not for sexual assault, harassment, and abuse.

 

[hawkeyefan]

That's certainly the way people seem to be thinking. The whole movement in general gives me an unshakable vibe that reminds me of when I read The Crucible back in highschool

EDIT:

"Is the accuser always holy now? Were they born this morning as clean as God’s fingers? I’ll tell you what’s walking Salem - vengeance is walking Salem. We are what we always were in Salem, but now the little crazy children are jangling the keys of the kingdom, and common vengeance writes the law! This warrant is vengeance! I’ll not give my wife to vengeance!" -from The Crucible

EDIT:

It also reminds me of McCarthyism and of the 1980s/1990's satanic panic witch trials (the McMartin case the Wee Care case, etc)

Nah. Times have changed, and information goes further. So does misinformation, it’s true, and ultimately none of us here actually know if Zak Smith is guilty of abuse or if Mandy and the others are guilty of slander.

But this is different because this is not a case of the government accusing anyone of wrong doing. What’s actually happening here is between individual parties. There’s no risk of jail time or the like.

People are free to side with whichever party they believe. They are free to judge the parties involved for themselves, and then act accordingly.

Will some of these people be wrong? Sure. But we’ll never actually know. None of us was there, none of us has all the necessary information to render a perfect decision.

And that’s part of the issue. This isn’t a criminal case. There will never be the “guilty” verdict that so many are crying for. In fact, in this case, it’s Mandy that’s being accused of wrong doing, not Zak. Whatever the ruling on this case is, it will not bring some universal sense of closure to the masses.

You may as well say “I’ll believe Zak was guilty when the moon floats down from orbit and serves me tea” because it’s just as likely to happen.

So in the absence of that, I think we can all go ahead and feel about him however we’d like. My personal take is that he’s being judged just as much for general awfulness and being a real jagoff to too many people. And I say that as someone who quite liked his work.

 

[Gradine]

It was kind of destined for that from the beginning, wasn't it?

I like to think one day we'll be able to have these conversations without trolls demanding to be fed and so many still so willing to oblige