D&D 5E 5e CB's Stonefast OOC -- COMPLETE

[Forged Fury]

Since Colden barged through, is the door wide open now to where Fulgrim could see through it if he moved 10 feet?

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Sure.

 

[Skarsgard]

CB, just a reminder for the IC post, Colden declared he would use riposte as an reaction if missed by the orc. At the time I had no idea there were other guys in the room. For next time, can I just say I will riposte the first attack that misses him?

 

[CanadienneBacon]

I was just coming back to handle the riposte when I saw this. YES, and thanks for the prompt. I've had Colden riposte the dark elf in the IC. I've no problem with saying Colden ripostes the first attack that misses him.

 

[tuxgeo]

I was astonished by the November "Sage Advice" by Jeremy Crawford which came out today: he says there is no separate "Surprise Round" at the start of combat, but instead that creatures who are surprised in the first round of combat cannot act on their turn in that round. Thus, Initiative is called for before combat starts, and the (effective) "Surprise Round" (that appellation being deliberately placed within scare-quotes here) is actually the "first round of combat," and is supposed to occur in Initiative order.

Somehow, I missed that. (Maybe it was because I didn't actually read that part of the PHB. . . .)

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Thanks, [MENTION=61026]tuxgeo[/MENTION], for providing the link to the November Sage Advice. I remember thinking after having read the combat section in the PHB during one of our combats for Stonefast sometime this summer that combat started with Round 1 and that characters were either surprised or not surprised, and--if surprised--got no action for Round 1. We also had some confusion in that same combat about when to roll initiative. I could be mis-remembering, but I *think* I called for initiative (which raised eyebrows), then resolved surprise actions, then started into Round 1. I'm not sure it's worth scouring the IC to find the incident in question. Overall, I think I agree with Mr. Crawford's Sage Advice about surprise.

I'll say this, though. The Sage Advice makes absolutely no sense for a combat situation like we've just had in the IC this week, where the party happens upon a combat going on between other creatures. Some of you had the element of surprise...while the orcs and spider were caught surprised (by you, but not by one another). If we were to apply the Sage Advice to this situation, it would lead to the ludicrous result of the orcs and spider having to completely stop all activity for an entire round while we resolved your surprise actions against them. I wouldn't have wanted to do it that way. The spider was, for example, hell-bent on biting and stinging the orcs. Why should it lose an action because some other creature (the party) is spying on it?

Moreover, I don't feel at all compelled to adopt the Sage Advice as errata, generally. I'm pleased to read it when it comes out and am interested to hear what others say about it, and some of it makes sense and is a good fit for the style of game I want to run. But I stopped feeling the need to follow it as gospel when, for example, Jeremy Crawford stated that Shield Master grants the ability to shove prone before taking one's action for the round, thereby granting a character with the Shield Master feat the ability to gain advantage each and every round. I'm really glad 5e is explicit about empowering DMs and players to make decisions about what's best and most fun for their table. I'm definitely a RAF (rules as fun) adherent.

 

[Forged Fury]

I'm pretty sure the Sage ruling says that once you're engaged in combat and that first round has passed, you can't be surprised again. Yup, the second sentence of the first paragraph. At best, a new party entering the fight could gain the benefit of being unseen if they approached stealthily, but not surprise. Once combat is joined, you're basically considered to be fully alert to your surroundings. I don't see a disconnect, personally.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

I'm pretty sure the Sage ruling says that once you're engaged in combat and that first round has passed, you can't be surprised again. Yup, the second sentence of the first paragraph.

Glad you pointed that out, thanks.

Though, I don't think I'd be an ounce surprised to find someone arguing somewhere that the definition of "a fight" is insular and specific to parties, and not an ongoing status. Not saying I agree with that interpretation (I don't), just that I see how the Sage Advice phrasing leaves it subject to (mis-)interpretation.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

Hey, there's some possibility I made an error regarding Maximilian's earthen grasp, [MENTION=95059]Forged Fury[/MENTION]. Let me know what you think (I don't want to retcon, the error is in Fulgrim's favor and I'm happy with the way things turned out). I think Fulgrim didn't have line of sight to the hand to direct it to R44. What's your read of the spell? It's reasonably clear to me that line of sight is required to place the hand when the hand first appears, but what I'm less clear about is whether the caster needs continued line of sight as he moves the hand about here and there in subsequent rounds. For ease of reference, I'll cut and paste the spell description from EEPC:

[sblock=Maximilian's earthen grasp]Maximilian’s earthen grasp
2nd-level transmutation

Casting Time: 1 action
Range: 30 feet
Components: V, S, M (a miniature hand sculpted from clay)
Duration: Concentration, up to 1 minute

You choose a 5-foot-square unoccupied space on the ground that you can see within range. A Medium hand made from compacted soil rises there and reaches for one creature you can see within 5 feet of it. The target must make a Strength saving throw. On a failed save, the target takes 2d6 bludgeoning damage and is restrained for the spell’s duration.

As an action, you can cause the hand to crush the restrained target, who must make a Strength saving throw. It takes 2d6 bludgeoning damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.

To break out, the restrained target can make a Strength check against your spell save DC. On a success, the target escapes and is no longer restrained by the hand.

As an action, you can cause the hand to reach for a different creature or to move to a different unoccupied space within range. The hand releases a restrained target if you do either.[/sblock]

 

[Forged Fury]

I think you have to have line of sight to move it into the square in question. With that said, Fulgrim had his full movement left and could have moved into position to see R44. I had intended on putting something to that effect in my post, but forgot to do so.